Hi All, Are there still many here? Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my external mixer. The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to record a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the channel strip [ I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in because the signal fluctuated in level quite a lot]. I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything either - as far as I know everything was activated. The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating signals. Many thanks in anticipation, Stef Windows XP Pro, M_Audio Delta 2496 Soundcard, Cubase SE 1, Mackie 1202 mixer.
"Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message news:... > Hi All, > Are there still many here? > > Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix > straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my external > mixer. > The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to record > a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the channel strip [ > I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in because the signal > fluctuated in level quite a lot]. > I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring > directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything > either - as far as I know everything was activated. > > The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I > missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? > I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but > compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating > signals. > > Many thanks in anticipation, > > Stef > > > Windows XP Pro, M_Audio Delta 2496 Soundcard, Cubase SE 1, Mackie 1202 > mixer. You dont say which channel, there are two sets of channels (open the mixer ) the input channels, and the output channels, the insert needs to be on the input channel. Jeff
The message <> from "Jim Panzee" <> contains these words: > "Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message > news:... > > Hi All, > > Are there still many here? > > > > Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix > > straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my external > > mixer. > > The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to record > > a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the channel strip [ > > I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in because the signal > > fluctuated in level quite a lot]. > > I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring > > directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything > > either - as far as I know everything was activated. > > > > The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I > > missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? > > I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but > > compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating > > signals. > > > > Many thanks in anticipation, > > > > Stef > > > > > > Windows XP Pro, M_Audio Delta 2496 Soundcard, Cubase SE 1, Mackie 1202 > > mixer. > You dont say which channel, there are two sets of channels (open the > mixer ) the input channels, and the output channels, the insert needs to be > on the input channel. > Jeff Thanks for your prompt reply. As I understand it, the Cubase channel strip is either for recording [record button armed] or playback. After some experimentation it seems to me that: 1. Both inserts and sends have their outputs bussed to the master output - I can see the effects levels changing quite clearly on the Master meters. 2. There appears to be no way that the FX inserts are in the audio chain before recording to hard disc - the effects levels do not show on the channel strip meters. So, I cannot see a way of making a live recording of say, vocals, using VST effects. I would have to add effects later. Of course, this is normal practice except in the case of compression/limiting/gating where it might be useful to have an acoustic signal treated earlier in the audio chain before recording it. All this conversation hinges on the fact that I am using Cubase SE1 - perhaps later versions of cubase allow a more flexible positioning of VST effects in the audio chain. Unless I am missing the blindingly obvious, I will have to treat signals with a wide dynamic range with an external comp/limiter before they enter Cubase. Am I right or wrong? Many thanks in anticipation Stef Many thanks
> Thanks for your prompt reply. > As I understand it, the Cubase channel strip is either for recording > [record button armed] or playback. > After some experimentation it seems to me that: > 1. Both inserts and sends have their outputs bussed to the master output > - I can see the effects levels changing quite clearly on the Master > meters. > 2. There appears to be no way that the FX inserts are in the audio chain > before recording to hard disc - the effects levels do not show on the > channel strip meters. > So, I cannot see a way of making a live recording of say, vocals, > using VST effects. I would have to add effects later. Of course, this is > normal practice except in the case of compression/limiting/gating where > it might be useful to have an acoustic signal treated earlier in the > audio chain before recording it. > All this conversation hinges on the fact that I am using Cubase SE1 - > perhaps later versions of cubase allow a more flexible positioning of > VST effects in the audio chain. Unless I am missing the blindingly > obvious, I will have to treat signals with a wide dynamic range with an > external comp/limiter before they enter Cubase. Am I right or wrong? I believe you are looking in the wrong place. Open the Mixer window. In the middle will be channels that correspond to audio tracks. Effects applied here will affect only playback. To the left of this will be the Input channels. Your effects should be placed there. Hope this helps, Jos. -- Ardis Park Music www.ardispark.nl
Jim Panzee wrote: > "Stefan W. Bojczuk" >> Hi All, >> Are there still many here? A few ones... >> Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix >> straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my >> external mixer. >> The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to >> record a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the >> channel strip [ I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in >> because the signal fluctuated in level quite a lot]. >> I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring >> directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything >> either - as far as I know everything was activated. >> >> The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I >> missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? >> I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but >> compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other >> fluctuating signals. >> >> Many thanks in anticipation, >> >> Stef >> >> >> Windows XP Pro, M_Audio Delta 2496 Soundcard, Cubase SE 1, Mackie >> 1202 mixer. > > You dont say which channel, there are two sets of channels (open the > mixer ) the input channels, and the output channels, the insert needs > to be on the input channel. while that´s true, it´s pretty useless for a limiter or comp on the input. the problem is, that one does not want the level going into the soundcard/audio interface (before it can even reach Cubase or any other software) to go over 0 dBFS. A software plug-in can only affect the signal AFTER the critical stage of A/D conversion! IF digital distortion has already happened in this stage, a software limiter can´t undo this!!! So, IF you feel the need of a limiter or compressor in your recording signal chain, it *must* be inserted in the analog signal chain to make any sense!In other words: you will have to use an external hardware comp/limiter to tame the input levels. Otherwise, turn down the gain on your audio interface input, if possible....;-) Phil
Effects in Cubase's channel strips are applied only on playback. Later versions of Cubase have Input strips in the Mixer. Effects inserted here are recorded. There's little point in inserting a compressor or limiter here. I can't do anything useful. The dynamic range at the input has already been defined. CubaseFAQ page: http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
"Laurence Payne" <> wrote in message news:... > Effects in Cubase's channel strips are applied only on playback. > > Later versions of Cubase have Input strips in the Mixer. Effects > inserted here are recorded. > > There's little point in inserting a compressor or limiter here. I > can't do anything useful. The dynamic range at the input has already > been defined. > > CubaseFAQ page: http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm Now thats strange, as when I record a bass guitar via a POD into a Moto828mk2, I then add a VST (internal) compressor into the insert of the Cubase 5 input channel, I get a lovely pumping effect, showing that the compresser is working, I also use it to smooth out vocal levels on recording, with a touch of compresion on the input, and another set on the output at mixdown, this gives a nice subtle compression effect without being too drastic. Jeff
"Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message news:... > Hi All, > Are there still many here? > > Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix > straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my external > mixer. > The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to record > a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the channel strip [ > I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in because the signal > fluctuated in level quite a lot]. > I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring > directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything > either - as far as I know everything was activated. > > The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I > missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? > I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but > compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating > signals. > > Many thanks in anticipation, In Cubase, you can record FX on tracks made with VST instruments, but not with most external hardware. Some software platforms allow you to use plug-ins on live input, but the latency sucks.
On Fri, 29 May 2009 19:14:15 +0100, "Jim Panzee" <> wrote: >> There's little point in inserting a compressor or limiter here. I >> can't do anything useful. The dynamic range at the input has already >> been defined. >> >> CubaseFAQ page: http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm > > Now thats strange, as when I record a bass guitar via a POD into a >Moto828mk2, I then add a VST (internal) compressor into the insert of the >Cubase 5 input channel, I get a lovely pumping effect, showing that the >compresser is working, I also use it to smooth out vocal levels on >recording, with a touch of compresion on the input, and another set on the >output at mixdown, this gives a nice subtle compression effect without being >too drastic. I should have said "it doesn't do anything more useful than putting the effect in the channel strip." I fact, it's a little less useful. It limits your options. Some would argue this as an artistic plus. I can't see it CubaseFAQ page: http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
"Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message news:... > Hi All, > Are there still many here? > > Normally, with all the synth hardware + FX I have, I record a mix > straight to Cubase stereo tracks and monitor directly from my external > mixer. > The other evening I was really radical [!] and decided to try to record > a synth part to Cubase with an FX added as insert on the channel strip [ > I was using the standard Cubase Limiter plug-in because the signal > fluctuated in level quite a lot]. > I did not expect to hear any change because I was still monitoring > directly from my hardware mixer but the Limiter did not do anything > either - as far as I know everything was activated. > > The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I > missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? > I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but > compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating > signals. > > Many thanks in anticipation, > > Stef > > > Windows XP Pro, M_Audio Delta 2496 Soundcard, Cubase SE 1, Mackie 1202 mixer.
Many thanks to all of you. I will check with someone who has Cubase 4 - I think what I want to do can only be done as some of you described with 'input channels' in the mixer - must be an improved feature over SE 1. Someday I might upgrade... I agree I might be better comp/limiting with hardware before the analogue signal reaches the A/D converters. Stef
On Mon, 1 Jun 2009 21:09:37 +0100, Stefan W. Bojczuk <> wrote: >I will check with someone who has Cubase 4 - I think what I want to do >can only be done as some of you described with 'input channels' in the >mixer - must be an improved feature over SE 1. >Someday I might upgrade... >I agree I might be better comp/limiting with hardware before the >analogue signal reaches the A/D converters. Think carefully why you're doing it at all. The old reason - to get better s/n ratio onto tape - is obsolete. CubaseFAQ page: http://www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm
>"Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message >news:... >> The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I >> missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? >> I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but >> compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating >> signals. >> >> Many thanks in anticipation, As mentioned.... there is no point in doing this, you gain nothing and lose options. A signal peak that happens at the audio device input can't be controlled by a compressor/limiter that's placed further down the line, the damage is already done. The comp/limiter has to be external between the mic and the audio device input. Ap
----- Original Message ----- From: "Aphelion" <> Newsgroups: alt.steinberg.cubase Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 8:49 PM Subject: Re: recording with FX > >>"Stefan W. Bojczuk" <> wrote in message >>news:... > >>> The question is: can cubase FX only be used post-recording or [am I >>> missing something] can FX plug-ins be recorded 'live' so to speak? >>> I am aware that recording with FX is bad practice in many cases but >>> compression/limiting is often used on live vocals and other fluctuating >>> signals. >>> >>> Many thanks in anticipation, > > As mentioned.... there is no point in doing this, you gain nothing and > lose options. > > A signal peak that happens at the audio device input can't be > controlled by a compressor/limiter that's placed further down the > line, the damage is already done. The comp/limiter has to be external > between the mic and the audio device input. > > Ap A compressor isn't just used to cut down peaks on the input ( thats called a bad recording ), it can be used to smooth out the varying levels of the recorded signal, try a small amount of compression on the input signal (ie the one thats recording by adding compression to the input channel on Cubase) then once recorded, treat the recorded signal with a little more compression, (on the Cubase output channel) this gives a nice smooth compressed signal that isnt noticable by over compression, and gives a strong output. A siganl peak at the audio device input can only be controled via the input slider on the actual input device or an external compressor as Aphelion sugests. But that isnt the only use for a compressor. It can also be used to great effect on a bass guitar, to give a rhythmic pumping sound, try listening to a few of the early "Who" records for an example of Bass pumping.
On Tue, 9 Jun 2009 09:17:47 +0100, "Jim Panzee" <> wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Aphelion" <> >Newsgroups: alt.steinberg.cubase >Sent: Monday, June 08, 2009 8:49 PM >Subject: Re: recording with FX >> >> As mentioned.... there is no point in doing this, you gain nothing and >> lose options. >> >> A signal peak that happens at the audio device input can't be >> controlled by a compressor/limiter that's placed further down the >> line, the damage is already done. The comp/limiter has to be external >> between the mic and the audio device input. >> >> Ap >A compressor isn't just used to cut down peaks on the input ( thats called a >bad recording ), it can be used to smooth out the >varying levels of the recorded signal, try a small amount of compression on >the input signal (ie the one thats recording by adding compression to the >input channel on Cubase) then once recorded, treat the recorded signal with >a little more compression, (on the Cubase output channel) this gives a nice >smooth compressed signal that isnt noticable by over compression, and gives >a strong output. A siganl peak at the audio device input can only be >controled via the input slider on the actual input device or an external >compressor as Aphelion sugests. But that isnt the only use for a compressor. >It can also be used to great effect on a bass guitar, to give a rhythmic >pumping sound, try listening to a few of the early "Who" records for an >example of Bass pumping. I understand how they're used... what I'm saying is it gives one nothing besides reduced options. You can achieve the same effect you describe by using two compressers on adjacent inserts....and, have a better chance of controlling noise and artifacts. Ap
