After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't play. What am I doing wrong? -- Cheers, Ben
"Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote in message news:... > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't play. > What am I doing wrong? Make sure you're exporting in a format (i.e. sample rate and bit depth) that your player can handle. I think the default is probably 64-bit (or maybe 32-bit if you're using the 32-bit audio engine?) and the same sample rate as you're using in your project, but I'm pretty sure 64-bit is not something Windows Media Player, for example, can handle. Some of the default formats can be changed in the Audio Options (or is that the Audio tab of the Global Options?), but I'm don't recall if this specific one can. I do recall it allows changing the imported audio file bit-depth (I usually just leave it as the source format since there's no benefit to sending it upwards at that level), and the rendering format for internal audio files (e.g. from doing a freeze -- I usually make that 64-bit to keep maximum resolution so as not to force bit reduction from a freeze), and there is at least one more that I don't recall off the top of my head. Rick -- ======================================= Rick Paul Closet Cowboy Music (ASCAP) Web: www.RickPaul.info MySpace: www.myspace.com/rickpaulmusic =======================================
On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote: >After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't play. >What am I doing wrong? I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying win media player can't play the file? When you export you can choose 16 bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent then you may have another track soloed or the synth track muted, that will produce a silent wav file Hope that helps. -- Gerry Peters
Rick Paul wrote: > "Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote in message > news:... > > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't > > play. What am I doing wrong? > > Make sure you're exporting in a format (i.e. sample rate and bit > depth) that your player can handle. I think the default is probably > 64-bit (or maybe 32-bit if you're using the 32-bit audio engine?) and > the same sample rate as you're using in your project, but I'm pretty > sure 64-bit is not something Windows Media Player, for example, can > handle. > > Some of the default formats can be changed in the Audio Options (or > is that the Audio tab of the Global Options?), but I'm don't recall > if this specific one can. I do recall it allows changing the > imported audio file bit-depth (I usually just leave it as the source > format since there's no benefit to sending it upwards at that level), > and the rendering format for internal audio files (e.g. from doing a > freeze -- I usually make that 64-bit to keep maximum resolution so as > not to force bit reduction from a freeze), and there is at least one > more that I don't recall off the top of my head. > > Rick Thanks. I'll take the check mark out of the 64 bit. Bet that's it. We'll see. -- Cheers, Ben
Gerry Peters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" > <> wrote: > > > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't > > play. What am I doing wrong? > > I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it > plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying win > media player can't play the file? When you export you can choose 16 > bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent then you may > have another track soloed or the synth track muted, that will produce > a silent wav file > > Hope that helps. Thanks. The Media Player, Real Player, and Sound Forge won't open it, saying I need the correct codec. I think Rick hit it about the 64 bit setting issue. Am going to check that out now. -- Cheers, Ben
Rick Paul wrote: > "Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote in message > news:... > > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't > > play. What am I doing wrong? > > Make sure you're exporting in a format (i.e. sample rate and bit > depth) that your player can handle. I think the default is probably > 64-bit (or maybe 32-bit if you're using the 32-bit audio engine?) and > the same sample rate as you're using in your project, but I'm pretty > sure 64-bit is not something Windows Media Player, for example, can > handle. > > Some of the default formats can be changed in the Audio Options (or > is that the Audio tab of the Global Options?), but I'm don't recall > if this specific one can. I do recall it allows changing the > imported audio file bit-depth (I usually just leave it as the source > format since there's no benefit to sending it upwards at that level), > and the rendering format for internal audio files (e.g. from doing a > freeze -- I usually make that 64-bit to keep maximum resolution so as > not to force bit reduction from a freeze), and there is at least one > more that I don't recall off the top of my head. > > Rick That did it. Thanks. I made a new project with 16 bit and exported to 16 bit. The default in both cases was 64. :-/ All better now! -- Cheers, Ben
Gerry Peters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" > <> wrote: > > > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't > > play. What am I doing wrong? > > I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it > plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying win > media player can't play the file? When you export you can choose 16 > bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent then you may > have another track soloed or the synth track muted, that will produce > a silent wav file > > Hope that helps. It was the 16 bit 64 bit issue Rick suggested. I set everything to 16 bit and the exported wav is readable now. ) -- Cheers, Ben
On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 23:11:53 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote: >Gerry Peters wrote: > >> On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" >> <> wrote: >> >> > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't >> > play. What am I doing wrong? >> >> I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it >> plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying win >> media player can't play the file? When you export you can choose 16 >> bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent then you may >> have another track soloed or the synth track muted, that will produce >> a silent wav file >> >> Hope that helps. > >It was the 16 bit 64 bit issue Rick suggested. I set everything to 16 >bit and the exported wav is readable now. ) Glad it worked out. You can get Win Media player to play 24 bit wav files. The fix is below if you need it, but by now the new Win Media player I would think would do that without having to do this tweak. I can send you the zip file if that link isn't good anymore or do a google search. http://www.chrisnet.net/msdn/AudioTypeConvert.zip Download it, Unzip it, and place the AudioTypeConvert.ax file in your System32 folder. Then open a Command Prompt and register it with this: regsvr32 c:\windows\system32\AudioTypeConvert.ax If you want to remove it at anytime just unregister it with: regsvr32 /U c:\windows\system32\AudioTypeConvert.ax -- Gerry Peters
Gerry Peters wrote: > On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 23:11:53 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" > <> wrote: > > > Gerry Peters wrote: > > > >> On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" > >> <> wrote: > >> > >> > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't > >> > play. What am I doing wrong? > >> > >> I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it > >> plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying > win >> media player can't play the file? When you export you can > choose 16 >> bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent > then you may >> have another track soloed or the synth track muted, > that will produce >> a silent wav file > >> > >> Hope that helps. > > > > It was the 16 bit 64 bit issue Rick suggested. I set everything to > > 16 bit and the exported wav is readable now. ) > > Glad it worked out. You can get Win Media player to play 24 bit wav > files. The fix is below if you need it, but by now the new Win Media > player I would think would do that without having to do this tweak. I > can send you the zip file if that link isn't good anymore or do a > google search. > > http://www.chrisnet.net/msdn/AudioTypeConvert.zip > > Download it, Unzip it, and place the AudioTypeConvert.ax file in your > System32 folder. > Then open a Command Prompt and register it with this: > > regsvr32 c:\windows\system32\AudioTypeConvert.ax > > If you want to remove it at anytime just unregister it with: > > regsvr32 /U c:\windows\system32\AudioTypeConvert.ax Thanks. No troubles with Media Player 11. Email me anytime. -- Cheers, Ben
Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for any other uses where you are creating intermediate files where you want to preserve full resolution. The time you need to go to 16-bit is just on your mixes for people to play (or to play in consumer-type programs yourself). You can set the export format in the File Export dialog box to do that. I make some presets, like CD Quality Mix (I think they have a built-in one something like that, too, but I change a few things from the defaults), so I just have to pick a preset and get all the settings I want for the particular context. That way it doesn't affect anything else, just the final output. Whereas if you change the defaults for internal stuff, like freezing, final mix quality may be adversely affected. Rick -- ======================================= Rick Paul Closet Cowboy Music (ASCAP) Web: www.RickPaul.info MySpace: www.myspace.com/rickpaulmusic ======================================= "Benjamin Goldman" <> wrote in message news:... > Gerry Peters wrote: > >> On Sat, 10 Jul 2010 11:32:16 -0700, "Benjamin Goldman" >> <> wrote: >> >> > After I freeze a soft synth track and then export to WAV it won't >> > play. What am I doing wrong? >> >> I assume you mean the exported wav file won't play. Do you mean it >> plays but there is silence or do you get an error message saying win >> media player can't play the file? When you export you can choose 16 >> bit 44.1., if that doesn't play or plays but is silent then you may >> have another track soloed or the synth track muted, that will produce >> a silent wav file >> >> Hope that helps. > > It was the 16 bit 64 bit issue Rick suggested. I set everything to 16 > bit and the exported wav is readable now. ) > > -- > Cheers, > Ben
Rick Paul wrote: > it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for any other > uses where you are creating intermediate files where you want to > preserve full resolution. Thanks again, Rick. -- Cheers, Ben
The killer robot "Rick Paul" <> grabbed the controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... > Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for any > other uses where you are creating intermediate files where you want to > preserve full resolution. The time you need to go to 16-bit is just > on your mixes for people to play (or to play in consumer-type programs > yourself). Unless you're me, then you wanna go 16/44 from the start, and spend all your time making music on your DAW instead of troubleshooting it! <g> -- Remove YourHeadFromYourAss to Reply by email ________ __ / ____/ /__ ____ ____ / /_ ____ / / __/ / _ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \ / /_/ / / __/ / / / / / / /_/ / /_/ / \____/_/\___/_/ /_/_/ /_/_.___/\____/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- Glennbo http://www.soundclick.com/glennbo Non-Linear Sound http://www.soundclick.com/jambits Hear My Music http://www.soundclick.com/ThePseudonyms
"Glennbo" <> wrote in message news:Xns9DB35763E7CCDBrownShoesDontMakeIt@81.169.183.62... > The killer robot "Rick Paul" <> grabbed the > controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... > >> Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for any >> other uses where you are creating intermediate files where you want to >> preserve full resolution. The time you need to go to 16-bit is just >> on your mixes for people to play (or to play in consumer-type programs >> yourself). > > Unless you're me, then you wanna go 16/44 from the start, and spend all > your time making music on your DAW instead of troubleshooting it! <g> It's one thing to start at 16/44.1 -- I might quibble with that versus 24/44.1 due to headroom considerations, but, if you're careful on your gain staging ahead of you're A/D converters or using really limited dynamic range inputs, it's no big deal. Personally, I do need the extra headroom, because I don't use a compressor ahead of my A/D converters since I have higher quality plug-in compressors than my old Behringer hardware compressor, so I just record at low enough levels to guarantee I don't overload the A/D converters, which means needing the extra precision to make up for not using the high end of the dynamic range (I.e. other than for stuff that needs to get limited). It's another thing together, though, to have intermediate files, such as freeze results and submixes, bit-reduced and dithered down to 16/44.1, when the internal mixing engine will be 32-bits at a minimum or 64-bit if you're using the 64-bit audio engine. That represents the possibility of multiple losses of quality enroute to even getting to the final mix (which necessarily needs a loss in quality if you're going down to CD quality or worse). That's a difference that is easily hearable based on my past testing of this back when I was trying to decide whether to go from 24-bit renders for intermediate files to 32-bit renders before 64-bit was even an option. I can't see where it has anything to do with troubleshooting. We're talking set it and forget it stuff, and the defaults don't make such compromises, so you'd have to manually make them if you want to go that low. The only time you'd possibly run into trouble is if you tried to do something like use Sound Forge to edit the intermediate files (no issues there if you're using the 32-bit files, but the version of SF I have, which is not the latest, doesn't support 64-bit files). Rick -- ======================================= Rick Paul Closet Cowboy Music (ASCAP) Web: www.RickPaul.info MySpace: www.myspace.com/rickpaulmusic =======================================
Rick Paul wrote: > "Glennbo" <> wrote in message > news:Xns9DB35763E7CCDBrownShoesDontMakeIt@81.169.183.62... >The > killer robot "Rick Paul" <> grabbed the > > controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these > > buttons... > > > > > Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and > > > for any other uses where you are creating intermediate files > > > where you want to preserve full resolution. The time you need to > > > go to 16-bit is just on your mixes for people to play (or to play > > > in consumer-type programs yourself). > > > > Unless you're me, then you wanna go 16/44 from the start, and spend > > all your time making music on your DAW instead of troubleshooting > > it! <g> > > It's one thing to start at 16/44.1 -- I might quibble with that > versus 24/44.1 due to headroom considerations, but, if you're careful > on your gain staging ahead of you're A/D converters or using really > limited dynamic range inputs, it's no big deal. Personally, I do > need the extra headroom, because I don't use a compressor ahead of my > A/D converters since I have higher quality plug-in compressors than > my old Behringer hardware compressor, so I just record at low enough > levels to guarantee I don't overload the A/D converters, which means > needing the extra precision to make up for not using the high end of > the dynamic range (I.e. other than for stuff that needs to get > limited). > > It's another thing together, though, to have intermediate files, such > as freeze results and submixes, bit-reduced and dithered down to > 16/44.1, when the internal mixing engine will be 32-bits at a minimum > or 64-bit if you're using the 64-bit audio engine. That represents > the possibility of multiple losses of quality enroute to even getting > to the final mix (which necessarily needs a loss in quality if you're > going down to CD quality or worse). That's a difference that is > easily hearable based on my past testing of this back when I was > trying to decide whether to go from 24-bit renders for intermediate > files to 32-bit renders before 64-bit was even an option. > > I can't see where it has anything to do with troubleshooting. We're > talking set it and forget it stuff, and the defaults don't make such > compromises, so you'd have to manually make them if you want to go > that low. The only time you'd possibly run into trouble is if you > tried to do something like use Sound Forge to edit the intermediate > files (no issues there if you're using the 32-bit files, but the > version of SF I have, which is not the latest, doesn't support 64-bit > files). > > Rick Neither does mine; Sound Forge Studio 6.0. -- Cheers, Ben
My name must actually be Glennbo then! <vbg> Same here, 16/44 all the way... fast and efficient. If there are fidelity losses with this vs. converting back and forth amongst higher bit rates or sample rates I've not noticed them. But perhaps my 'ear palette' is just not refined enough to detect the difference. In any event most of my music is heard by the 'bengay crowd' (my church congregation) and 8 bit would probably suffice -- Sue Morton "Glennbo" <> wrote in message news:Xns9DB35763E7CCDBrownShoesDontMakeIt@81.169.183.62... > The killer robot "Rick Paul" <> grabbed the > controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... > >> Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for >> any >> other uses where you are creating intermediate files where you want >> to >> preserve full resolution. The time you need to go to 16-bit is just >> on your mixes for people to play (or to play in consumer-type >> programs >> yourself). > > Unless you're me, then you wanna go 16/44 from the start, and spend > all > your time making music on your DAW instead of troubleshooting it! <g> >
The killer robot "Rick Paul" <> grabbed the controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... >>> Yeah, but it's best to keep 64-bit checked for the engine, and for >>> any other uses where you are creating intermediate files where you >>> want to preserve full resolution. The time you need to go to 16-bit >>> is just on your mixes for people to play (or to play in >>> consumer-type programs yourself). >> >> Unless you're me, then you wanna go 16/44 from the start, and spend >> all your time making music on your DAW instead of troubleshooting it! >> <g> > > It's one thing to start at 16/44.1 -- I might quibble with that versus > 24/44.1 due to headroom considerations, but, if you're careful on your > gain staging ahead of you're A/D converters or using really limited > dynamic range inputs, it's no big deal. Personally, I do need the > extra headroom, because I don't use a compressor ahead of my A/D > converters since I have higher quality plug-in compressors than my old > Behringer hardware compressor, so I just record at low enough levels > to guarantee I don't overload the A/D converters, which means needing > the extra precision to make up for not using the high end of the > dynamic range (I.e. other than for stuff that needs to get limited). I don't need the extra headroom, and my outboard hardware compressor is very high quality. I record with my DAW the same way I did with my $10,000.00 Ampex 1". Nice and hot, but with no overs going in. Once recorded, I still use software compression, sometimes as many as three inline to tame too wide of a spectrum of amplitude. > It's another thing together, though, to have intermediate files, such > as freeze results and submixes, bit-reduced and dithered down to > 16/44.1, when the internal mixing engine will be 32-bits at a minimum > or 64-bit if you're using the 64-bit audio engine. That represents > the possibility of multiple losses of quality enroute to even getting > to the final mix (which necessarily needs a loss in quality if you're > going down to CD quality or worse). That's a difference that is > easily hearable based on my past testing of this back when I was > trying to decide whether to go from 24-bit renders for intermediate > files to 32-bit renders before 64-bit was even an option. I *NEVER* freeze anything, or mix down any tracks in any of my productions. My DAW runs so efficient that I don't ever need to, and that's at the 1ms (64 samples) that I run it at from the start to the final mixdown finish. > I can't see where it has anything to do with troubleshooting. We're > talking set it and forget it stuff, and the defaults don't make such > compromises, so you'd have to manually make them if you want to go > that low. The only time you'd possibly run into trouble is if you > tried to do something like use Sound Forge to edit the intermediate > files (no issues there if you're using the 32-bit files, but the > version of SF I have, which is not the latest, doesn't support 64-bit > files). Hehe, I'm referring to all the fiddling people do with their DAWs trying to make it more pristine than live (just wait till everyone goes 128 bit, that will be so awesome!), only to glob on a bunch of Vintage Warmers to distort the sound so it's enjoyable to listen to again. -- Remove YourHeadFromYourAss to Reply by email ________ __ / ____/ /__ ____ ____ / /_ ____ / / __/ / _ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \ / /_/ / / __/ / / / / / / /_/ / /_/ / \____/_/\___/_/ /_/_/ /_/_.___/\____/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- Glennbo http://www.soundclick.com/glennbo Non-Linear Sound http://www.soundclick.com/jambits Hear My Music http://www.soundclick.com/ThePseudonyms
The killer robot "Sue Morton" <> grabbed the controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... > My name must actually be Glennbo then! <vbg> Same here, 16/44 all the > way... fast and efficient. If there are fidelity losses with this vs. > converting back and forth amongst higher bit rates or sample rates I've > not noticed them. But perhaps my 'ear palette' is just not refined > enough to detect the difference. > > In any event most of my music is heard by the 'bengay crowd' (my church > congregation) and 8 bit would probably suffice I've never had anyone say "eew, that sounds like a 16/44 recording", but I have had people who record for a living tell me that I get a great sound out of my studio. For me, it's about taking pictures, and the subject is the subject, not the camera. -- Remove YourHeadFromYourAss to Reply by email ________ __ / ____/ /__ ____ ____ / /_ ____ / / __/ / _ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \ / /_/ / / __/ / / / / / / /_/ / /_/ / \____/_/\___/_/ /_/_/ /_/_.___/\____/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- Glennbo http://www.soundclick.com/glennbo Non-Linear Sound http://www.soundclick.com/jambits Hear My Music http://www.soundclick.com/ThePseudonyms
On 13/07/2010 14:50, Glennbo wrote: > The killer robot "Sue Morton"<> grabbed the > controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... > >> My name must actually be Glennbo then!<vbg> Same here, 16/44 all the >> way... fast and efficient. If there are fidelity losses with this vs. >> converting back and forth amongst higher bit rates or sample rates I've >> not noticed them. But perhaps my 'ear palette' is just not refined >> enough to detect the difference. >> >> In any event most of my music is heard by the 'bengay crowd' (my church >> congregation) and 8 bit would probably suffice > > I've never had anyone say "eew, that sounds like a 16/44 recording", but I > have had people who record for a living tell me that I get a great sound > out of my studio. For me, it's about taking pictures, and the subject is > the subject, not the camera. > Sorry, you're both wrong here. The best way, by far, is to record everything at 64 bit 96KHz, and *then* run it through Izotope Trash (or Audioease Speakerphone), to sound like it's running through a megaphone. ;-) This way you'll get a true 64 bit quality megaphone sound. Then you can add Vintage Warmer if you want. This is the secret to sooper high quality soundz. -- =========== John Braner http://cdbaby.com/cd/JohnBraner http://www.soundclick.com/johnbraner
The killer robot John Braner <> grabbed the controls of the spaceship cakewalk.audio and pressed these buttons... >>> My name must actually be Glennbo then!<vbg> Same here, 16/44 all >>> the way... fast and efficient. If there are fidelity losses with >>> this vs. converting back and forth amongst higher bit rates or >>> sample rates I've not noticed them. But perhaps my 'ear palette' is >>> just not refined enough to detect the difference. >>> >>> In any event most of my music is heard by the 'bengay crowd' (my >>> church congregation) and 8 bit would probably suffice >> >> I've never had anyone say "eew, that sounds like a 16/44 recording", >> but I have had people who record for a living tell me that I get a >> great sound out of my studio. For me, it's about taking pictures, >> and the subject is the subject, not the camera. >> > > Sorry, you're both wrong here. The best way, by far, is to record > everything at 64 bit 96KHz, and *then* run it through Izotope Trash > (or Audioease Speakerphone), to sound like it's running through a > megaphone. ;-) > > This way you'll get a true 64 bit quality megaphone sound. Then you > can add Vintage Warmer if you want. This is the secret to sooper high > quality soundz. The highest quality Rudy Vallee megaphone/distortion you can get!!! -- Remove YourHeadFromYourAss to Reply by email ________ __ / ____/ /__ ____ ____ / /_ ____ / / __/ / _ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \/ __ \ / /_/ / / __/ / / / / / / /_/ / /_/ / \____/_/\___/_/ /_/_/ /_/_.___/\____/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- Glennbo http://www.soundclick.com/glennbo Non-Linear Sound http://www.soundclick.com/jambits Hear My Music http://www.soundclick.com/ThePseudonyms
On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 00:09:24 -0700, "Rick Paul" <> wrote: >The only time >you'd possibly run into trouble is if you tried to do something like use >Sound Forge to edit the intermediate files (no issues there if you're using >the 32-bit files, but the version of SF I have, which is not the latest, >doesn't support 64-bit files). I just did a test 64 bit export. Windows and Vegas Pro 9 recognized it as a 64 bit file. It opened and played in SF Pro 10 but seemed to identify the file as 16 bit. 64 bit IEEE float is a record option in SF Pro 10. File Info in Audition 3 showed it as 64 bit IEEE Float. It played back fine. The status bar said it was playing back at 32 bit. FWIW this test was on a 32 bit OS. My 64 bit OS is Linux at the moment. My drive with Win7 Pro 64 bit is not in the machine right now. The file would not play with Gnome Mplayer or VLC on Linux Mint 64 but would with Movie Player and Rhythmbox if anyone cares. Ben N. Moore
