MIDI Out vs USB Out > iPhone

Discussion in 'MIDI' started by Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 22, 2018.

  1. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    Technology n00b here, currently running Digital Piano > Usb-Out to Host > Camera Connection kit > iPhone (GarageBand). I've noticed the external devices (iRigs, Plugkey, etc) all seem to be geared towards MIDI, rather than USB-o. Looking to approach as though I have an iPhone 7 (currently own iPhone 6 with broken headphone out). GarageBand recognizes my Yamaha digital piano as a controller, but the issue is direct monitoring without a headphone out. So far the only external device I've seen that is usb-b compatible is the Yamaha wireless adapter, which I imagine because of Bluetooth, would have latency issues. My goal is to use this both to record as well as play live.

    If only there were such a cable: USB-b Male > MIDI Male, my problem would be solved....?
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 22, 2018
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  2. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    Which Yamaha digital piano do you have? Am I correct in assuming that it has USB TO HOST but not MIDI DIN ports?
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 23, 2018
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  3. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    P-45, yes Usb to host
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 26, 2018
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  4. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    I did find a couple of Usb Midi Host modules, such as this one:

    https://www.amazon.com/midiplus-USB...091&sprefix=kenton+usb+&sr=8-1&ref=mp_s_a_1_1

    I’m assuming below would be my best bet..? Just want to be sure before purchasing any additional equipment. What do you think???

    Yamaha P-45
    ⬇️
    USB-b (to host) *out*
    ⬇️
    *into* Usb/Midi Box
    ⬇️
    Usb/Midi Box 5-pin *out*
    ⬇️
    *into* iRig or plugKey
    ⬇️
    Camera connection kit
    ⬇️
    iPhone
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 26, 2018
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  5. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    To be honest, I'm not sure I understand the need for an iRig or a MIDI USB host. Can you give me a better idea of what you're trying to accomplish?

    I thought I had understood that you're using the P-45 as a MIDI controller to play virtual instruments in GarageBand-- in which case a simple USB-MIDI connection from the P-45 to the Camera Connection Kit should be all you need-- but that the problem you're having is how to use headphones to monitor the sounds from GarageBand while recording?

    Note that if you're actually trying to record the sounds coming from the P-45, you should be making an audio connection from the P-45 to the iPhone, not a MIDI connection.

    Or, if you want to record both the P-45's audio and MIDI, as well as use it as a controller for playing virtual instruments, you'll need both types of connections.
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 27, 2018
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  6. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    SGG,
    Thank you for taking the time to help me. I appreciate everything! Indeed the issue is mainly about monitoring (IPhone 6sP, headphone out is stripped). Beginning with the iPhone 7, Apple started doing away with the 3.5mm altogether. I searched “IPhone 7-Ready GarageBand Connections”. I noticed that the iRig & a few others have a headphone out, and i thought that might work for me....?

    Although I’ve played (tinkered) for years, I never got into midi. For some reason, now that I’m over 40 (mid-life crisis:)) I’m giving one last honest effort at playing a few local gigs. So for several months now, I’ve been doing a lot of writing, and practicing every day for hours at a time. Ideally I want to approach local bar owners with a decent (ep) demo in-hand. Can’t afford a professional studio, but I’ve heard enough already of GarageBand to know that it should suffice, once i have all of the tools:)

    Definitely going to use the P-45 as both an audio input as well as a midi controller. I already have a new respect for sound engineering...talk about Hard Work!

    Are you open to a question ‘slightly’ off-topic, related mainly to recording vocals, and the best way to utilize an audio interface? I have a few tools (Behringer UMC22, as well as a Zoom H4 Handy Recorder)...ANYWAY, if that is not allowed I apologize and please disregard. Thank you again for all your help!!!
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 27, 2018
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  7. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Biggles

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    If one plugs into an 3.5mm socketless iPad or iPhone a genuine Apple camera adaptor which has a Lightning socket as well as a USB socket then plug in a set of headphones into the Lightning socket strange things happen.

    There seems to be a bug in IOS in that if a 3.5mm headphone adaptor or a pair of Apple headphones with a Lightning plug is inserted into the socket it brings up an error message ... this device is not supported.

    I have just done this with my system and plugged in my Kross 2 and just like the Op no audio monitoring is possible.

    I will try again later using my Behringer interface.
     
    Biggles, Sep 27, 2018
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  8. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    I use an inexpensive ($30 USD) Behringer UCA222 USB interface to record the audio from some of my Yamaha keyboards on my computer, laptop, or tablet. The Behringer has twin RCA inputs (L and R) so I use a 1/4" TRS to RCA stereo cable to connect the keyboard's PHONES/OUTPUT jack to the Behringer, then use the Behringer's built-in USB cable to connect to the computer, laptop, or tablet. The Behringer has a jack for connecting a pair of headphones so you can monitor the audio-- either the audio that's being received from the keyboard, or the audio that's coming back from the computer (if you select the Behringer as the audio output device on the computer).
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 27, 2018
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  9. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    As far as Apple mobile devices that don't have an audio jack, I suppose they expect you to use Bluetooth headphones or speakers? Hopefully the latency is low enough that you can't notice it, because otherwise it would be a reason not to use Apple mobile devices for doing any recording of musical instruments, which would run counter to Apple's fostered image.
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 27, 2018
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  10. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    Sounds like I’m going to have to suck it up & finally buy a laptop. Been putting off the inevitable too long.
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 27, 2018
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  11. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    Not sure if you’ve ever “overdone” your homework on any online audio purchases, but by the time I got to the UMC22, I literally had lost sight of what I actually needed, bouncing from review to review. Again, I am an uber-noob on the tech side, but I don’t believe it’s completely compatible with iOS (at least not my iphone). It cuts out a lot on me. Almost all of the reviews reference your computer/laptop, drivers to download, an actual settings menu. My UMC22 doesn’t have RCA-in, but rather (1) 1/4”-XLR Combo, & (1) standard 1/4” input. My trouble with the interface might also be related to the headphone issue. Until I have a laptop, I’ll probably just keep trying the Zoom as an Audio I/O, which I’ve had ‘some’ success with, just can’t seem to duplicate what i did to set it up.
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 27, 2018
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  12. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Cardboard_Cowboy

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    Definitely don’t want to go the Bluetooth route. I just read about Apple’s new portable Dragonfly adapter. Might be a solution. Uggh, more homework:)
     
    Cardboard_Cowboy, Sep 27, 2018
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  13. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    I forgot you mentioned that you already had an interface. The UMC22 has a headphones jack, so that should give you the ability to monitor your P-45 as you record. I haven't checked the user manual, but I think the "direct monitor" button should let you switch between listening to the P-45's audio before it goes to the iPhone, or after it comes back from the iPhone (if the iPhone and GarageBand are using the UMC22 for audio output).
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 27, 2018
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  14. Cardboard_Cowboy

    Biggles

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    Kross 2 > Behringer UMC204HD > Apple camera Adaptor > iPad > Garage Band

    This is the first time that I have used the iPad in this way.

    Started Garage Band, played a few chords and the VU meter registers the input, but there is no sound from the iPad (its an old one with 3.5mm headphone socket but I was not using headphones). Plugged headphones into the Behringer and again no sound.

    Started recording without monitoring sound, VU meters move, played a few chords, stopped recording, played back the track and sound comes from iPad.

    So no useful help from me.

    Do not have time to experiment further today.
     
    Biggles, Sep 27, 2018
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  15. Cardboard_Cowboy

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    If the interface was set to let you hear the sounds coming from the inputs-- rather than the sounds coming back from the computer (iPad)-- then you would/should have been able to hear something.
     
    SeaGtGruff, Sep 27, 2018
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