PC4 or Forte - Loading K2600 Sounds

[sanctuarylifesystems]

Hi Folks! Nice to meet you all.

I recently bought a Kurzweil PC4 which is a beautiful piece of kit! (apparently the Forte uses similar tech so this would apply to that also).

I have a K2600 with the "Best of V.A.S.T." sounds upgrade - which is a beautiful piece of kit for a couple of sounds that I use often such as the sound "Portal" and "Bell Players" both gorgeous unique sounds. Especially with portal as you can use the ribbon controller to really give the sound an organic feel.

I would like to load these few sounds, or even perhaps all of them and then sell the K2600 at some point as I am sure there would be an enthusiast out there who would give the K2600 the love that it deserves more than I would just using two or three sounds.

Does anyone know how to go about loading these sounds from the K2600 into the PC4? Obviously there is a USB port in the PC4, and there is a floppy drive in the K2600. I have heard that you need an external SCSI zip drive, plug it into the K2600, take the SYSEX files off the K2600 and load them to the USB and import them to the PC4 (or Forte or other newer Kurzweil).

Another way I am guessing might be to manually program in the V.A.S.T. parameters into a custom sound.

Another way might be to copy something to a floppy from the K2600 then use the floppy in my PC to transfer something to USB?

Does this sound about right? How do I actually do all this though? Or does someone already have the K2600 files that I can copy to my USB?

Cheers!

Michael

 

[happyrat1]

I would do more homework before attemtping this. The PC3K series can import K series sounds, sort of, with an additional expansion pack, but even then certain FX chains don't translate and sound the same on the PC3K as the original.

If I were you I'd tread carefully because this may not even be doable on the PC4 and Forte series.

I'd suggest visiting

https://forums.godlike.com.au/

and

http://www.ksetlist.com/

for some expert help on this.

Gary

 

[williamwill]

Go to the Kurzweil website and tap on the tab downloads. You will find your keyboard there the K2600.

You can probably find it there and download it onto thumb drive I've done this myself looking for additional patches. I have even contacted Kurzweil via email. They have been very helpful.
Good luck!

 

[Pet_er]

Hi

Since the new PC4 is mentioned here, I want to give a quick info about my short experience witht the PC4.

But first, sorry for my bad English. It is my third language that I speak.

Here ist my little story:
After reading all the reviews and articles and watching the videos about the PC4 I got conviced, that this will suit my needs for a pro keyboard and performance controller.

There was not dealer where I was able to try it out myself, so I ordered it at my local dealer that I trust.

When he got it he immediately called me and I came over. He showed me the most important things and I went off home to check it out in my living room.

The PC4 is light and easy to carry. Something that is important for me when gigging and traveling. Second it is not as wide as the PC3 or the Forte8, since the pitch and modulation wheels are above the keys.

It has a 256 polyphony, which is something I need when using layers and playing tracks from my DAW.

The keys are not as good as the ones on the Forte8 or some of the Nords. But this is due to the light weight.

Now the reason why I gave it back the same day I got it:

1. The on/off switch is a risk
You just need to touch the off/on switch very slightly and it powers off or on. The switch is made to push it in deeply, but the cheap design or quality of it allows it to switch the PC4 on or off when not moving the switch at all. In fact, one of my kids hardly touched it while I was trying out the sounds and it switched off immediately. Later on, when I left the PC4 switched on for about 10 minutes and came back, the keyboard was switched off. No one was in the room for sure. Later on it happend to me again.
Imagine at a concert...?!!

2. Display stays white after switching it on
I believe the same cheap power switch is at fault for this. If you switch the PC4 on, but you do not press (or push) fast enough all the way in, the PC4 boot process is somehow interrupted. In this case the unit does not start properly and remains with a white display and can't be played. You have to switch if off and on again and if you are lucky, the boot process will start correctly and when done the display shows all the expected information.

3. Aliasing / Phasing in the sounds
The sounds do have aliasing / phasing. I am not even talking about the mulit layered sounds. Just for example program 01 oder 04 for example (both grand pianos). It's like they are washed out, have no definition or clarity. I was using my Bose L1 and later on tried it with my Yamaha studio monitors.
I can't believe this is with purpose or even wanted from Kurzweil.
It becomes worse when using multi or layered sounds, which is something the PC4 would be awesome for.


4. Same samples are at fault
In the very short time I had the PC4, I was playing on program 01 (the reference grand piano sound). Some of the higher keys (higher pitch), only a few, do have kind of the pedal noise in the sample. If you play them and have a loudspeaker that can reproduce those lower frequencies, you can clearly hear that noise. And I was not using the sustain pedal at all! It is in the sample sound. The strange thing is, that the harder you hit those certain keys (or notes), the less it becomes aware to the ear. The softer you hit the keys, the louder it is perceived. in one octave,l if I remember correctly, it has been only 1 or 2 notes (keys) with this fault.

5. Detuning?
In the program 01 and 04 grand piano sound, at least for me, it sounds like the piano sound becomes more or less "detuned" depending how hard or soft you hit the keys.
Just one example: Playing a major G chord on the left hand with four fingers, try to hit it hard, middle and soft. And hear the different "tuning". For me it sounded almost like an old detuned upright piano in one of those old western movies.

6. Other problems
Some of the samples in those acoustic piano sounds are so different for different keys (or notes) in the same octave, that it is impossible to play a smooth sounding equal character or "sound", when using the dynamic of the loudness (soft to hard or very hard).
The plastic faders do not move equal in resistance. Some need more pressure or strength, especially at the upper third of the movement. Others don't.

Well, that was my very short time I had the PC4. I had it in my living room for about 3 hours and played on it for all together about 1,5 hours. I became so disappointed, that I gave it back at the same time I got it.

I don't know if "my" PC4 was a lemon or may be one of the very first ones that left the factory? I hope so and want Kurzweil to have success. But for all potential buyers I would recommend to check out for those problems before you spend your money on it.

Most of the problems can be solved via a firmware update. The power switch I don't know - but this is crucial for musicians who want to rely on the keyboard for live concerts and events.

I have written to Kurzweil about this and expect them to solve this problem in the near future.

I myself like Kurzweil and hope they will not decline from their high quality products and their quality level.
And again, sorry for my English. It is not my native language.

You all have a merry Christmas!
Peter

PS: Please don't get dissapointed when I don't reply to your comments or questions. I will be without internet for a certain time and usually to not spend much time on the internet either. But I will check from time to time. Thank you for your understading.

 

[happyrat1]

Not to sound negative here, but a lot of your criticisms are very subjective ones.

If, after reading this, anyone is completely turned off the PC4, I'd suggest visiting the Kurzweil Forums at

Log in

Log in

forums.godlike.com.au

http://www.ksetlist.com/

and getting a few more honest reviews.

I've heard some minor complaints about operating system bugs and such but nobody as completely negative as you seem to be.

It's never a good idea to base a major purchase on a single review anyway.

Gary

 

[Pet_er]

Hi Gary

You are absolutely right, it's just my own personal experience. And, as I have mentioned, I had the PC4 only for a really short time. But the issue with the power switch and not booting correctly, let me decide to return it, since I have to depend on this one keyboard/performance controller.

I really hope it was just a lemon or one of the very first items that left the factory with this fault. If those issues get solved I might get one. But will wait for now.

It was by no means my purpose to let Kurzweil look bad. Just to make buyers aware of the things I encountered. I like Kurzweil and their products and the new PC4 as well, that's why I got it in the first place.
I hope they can solve those issues. The Kurzweil PC4 comes with a lot good features and power under the hood. And the price for it really is good.

If you are reading this and interested in the PC4 than please go to a store and check it out yourself.

I will not have internet for the next couple of days.

Peter

 

[Biggles]

For £1800 I would expect a keyboard to be pretty well perfect with top quality switches, display, menu system and keybed.

A lemon by any other name is still a lemon.

Sorry to read about your bad experience, and there is nothing subjective about a switch that does not have a positive action and the sound issues you write about.

Good luck finding what you seek.

 

[williamwill]

Pet_er.
I can understand your concerns. When I received my PC4, setting it up and allowing it to acclimate to the room, I started playing it and the first chord stuck came a rattle under the case. I returned it for a replacement and had no further problems. The noise may have gone away after a while but it made me nervous that it could return.

I think you should have done a hard reset. This would have returned the PC4 to factory spec's. then check it out.
It does have a timer that's adjustable but I don't believe it should have shut down after the short time you mentioned.
I found that you need to make a firm push to turn it on. but a light touch to shut it down.

I have not experienced the problems you mention although I will say the Yamaha voices are superior to that of Kurzweil, in
every category. I was very disappointed with the harmonica on the Kurzweil. Yamaha has such good expressive voices.
I had a Yamaha YPG 625, with great voices but heavily menu driven and it was more for home use and not for professional usage.
But I did use it on a few gigs, it was all I had at the time.

 

[SeaGtGruff]

It does have a timer that's adjustable but I don't believe it should have shut down after the short time you mentioned.
I found that you need to make a firm push to turn it on. but a light touch to shut it down.

If it does have a timer, it might have been set to 10 minutes or so. On my Yamahas that have an auto-off feature, I think the factory default is 15 minutes, but I believe it can be set as low as 5 minutes. And if you leave the room to do something else, 15 minutes can fly by!

As for the power switch, I'd think it would be better to turn on with a light touch (but not too light), and require a firm push to shut it down.

 

[williamwill]

I didn't check but I think you're right that there is no timer on the Kurzweil I was thinking of the Yamaha at the time I responded.

Every switch is different in the way it responds to your touch. Doesn't matter if it's a wall switch or machine switch, there are many types of switches that respond a different way.

 

[williamwill]

Revise my last statement on a timer in the Kurzweil PC4

The PC4 has an automatic power saving feature (Auto Power Off) that can automatically
power off the PC4 after a period of inactivity, in order to conserve electricity. The Auto
Power Off feature is enabled by default. The default Power Off Time is 8 hours, which will
cause the PC4 to power off after 8 hours of inactivity.
A count down timer warning will be shown in the display a few minutes before the PC4 is
powered off. At any time, touching any PC4 control or playing a note will cause the PC4 to
remain powered on, until the PC4 has been inactive for the set Power Off Time.
Auto Power Off can be disabled in Global Mode. The Power Off Time can also be adjusted
in Global Mode.

 

[williamwill]

New Info on the Kurzweil PC4.
I was trying to save a program to the Quick Access View and could not find instructions in the Musician's Guide. I couldn't believe they missed that important task, being able to have quick access for programs/setups in live performance's. After talking to Kurzweil on the phone of another matter, He mentioned the revised Musician' Guide on the website. Today I found it at the beginning, in the Get Started Section. I emailed Kurzweil to suggest/request when revision's/addition's are made that they list them with their locations on the second page in the Musician's Guide. I also requested to share any other changes with me so I can bookmark it.

 

[Pet_er]

@williamwill

I did several hard resets with no avail. The mentioned problems remained the same.

The auto switch off was set on 8 hours. I didn't even had it that long ;-)

In my "review" I did not even mention all the negative things, just the "big ones".

Here are some more. If you own a PC4 please can you try it and respond here for all to see? May be it was just a lemon if you can't find these problems on your PC4:

- when switching to another sound while playing the keys, there is a delay (interruption of the sound) noticeable

- try Sound #39 (Film Piano) and play it in all different velocities. My PC4 suddenly became veeeery loud and the sound at the same time was distorted. For sure not what the sound programmer had in mind

- play a Demo i.e. from a sound and hit the buttons "User" + "0" at the same time and while doing so press the "stop" button. My PC4 always chrased when I did this (display stayed the same, no sound anymore from all outputs, no button/slider etc. operating anymore..)

- if the power on/off switch is not pressed really fast, sometimes the PC4 did not run the bootloader correctly and the display stayed just white. The PC4 was not playable at all.
I had to power it off and on again - sometimes several times - in order it would start correctly.

All this AFTER the update (at this date the newest update).

I wonder if you experience the same on your PC4?

Thank you!
Peter

 

[williamwill]

Hi Peter
as I said before I've never had any of the problems you're having
The hard reset did not change anything. Okay. Did you buy this unit brand new or used? If you bought it new there's a 2 year warranty I believe. If you bought it used I don't know if you're out of the warranty.
I won't be able to sit at my keyboard until this evening where I can review your problem sitting down.
You should contact Kurzweil support regardless if it's under warranty or not under warranty

I'll pick it back to you this evening

 

[Pet_er]

@williamwill

Wow, what a quick response ;-)

As mentioned in my first post, I gave the Kurzweil PC4 back to my dealer the same day I got it.

But thank you for your concern and help. I really appreciate it!!

Peter

 

[williamwill]

I'm curious. What dealer did you buy it from?

 

[Pet_er]

@williamwill

I bought it at a small dealer in Europe, since I live there. He has great knowledge and treats his customers good. And it was not his fault that I experienced all this problems.

Did you try on your PC4 what I was talking about in my thread from today?

Peter

 

[williamwill]

I purchased mine from Sweetwater Sound located in Fort Wayne in the state of Indiana USA. I drove down to that location and it is huge.
I stayed several hours because they were so many keyboards try out.

Check them out on the web. They have excellent service you will not be disappointed and you will find a keyboard there. I realize you have to sit down and try keyboards out to your liking. Let me know what you decide to buy. And better luck next time.