Portable Triple Pedals for Casios

Discussion in 'Casio Keyboards' started by Greg Barker, Aug 21, 2016.

  1. Greg Barker

    Greg Barker

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2016
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    San Luis Obispo, CA, USA
    I just bought a PX-160BK and did a little, but not enough, research on portable triple pedals for the keyboard. Casio's SP 33 is clearly not portable, but the keyboard is compatible with it, meaning it will work with a triple pedal. M-Audio won't tell me if their SP-Triple is compatible with my keyboard and I have not heard back from Studio Logic regarding their VFP-3-10. Has anyone had any success using either of these or another triple-pedal using either a PX-160 or another of Casio's keyboards compatible with the SP 33? Thanks.
     
    Greg Barker, Aug 21, 2016
    #1
    1. Advertisements

  2. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    I own an M-Audio SP-Triple that I use with a Kurzweil PC3K.

    It is definitely NOT compatible with the SP-33 or any of the Casio Keyboards. It is also NOT capable of Half Dampering.

    My understanding is that the Casio pedal uses a special proprietary connector and wiring arrangement to connect to their own keyboards.

    I have searched the web for a schematic for the Casio pedal and connector since this is not the first time this question has come up on forums but have never managed to find a wiring diagram.

    In theory, if you could lay your hands on a working SP-33 and could make some ohmmeter measurements with the pedals open and closed then you could potentially wire up any standard triple pedal to a Casio, either by soldering in a new connector or else by creating an adaptor cord that would plug between the pedal and the keyboard.

    Let me know if you ever come across such a schematic on the web.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 21, 2016
    #2
    1. Advertisements

  3. Greg Barker

    Greg Barker

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2016
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    San Luis Obispo, CA, USA
    Thanks for the confirmation of what I suspected for the M-Audio unit.

    Besides basic compatibility, one of my concerns about the Studio Logic unit is some of their on-line literature mentions it as being sustain pedals, nothing explicit about damper, sostenuto, sustain functions.

    Another thought that has occurred to me is simply (ha ha, simply) build a potable box and put the guts of the SP 33 into it, or put the Casio parts into the box of a used M-Audio or Studio Logic unit. It makes it more of a mechanical than an electrical task. Or, it may be as simple as cutting down the SP 33 and mounting it to a floor plate of sorts and fashioning some end caps.

    I'll wait to see if some better alternatives emerge before I embark on that path, however.
     
    Greg Barker, Aug 21, 2016
    #3
  4. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    All that a sustain or sostenudo pedal is is a simple single pole single throw switch connected to a pair of wires.

    A damper pedal that does half damper is a single pole double throw switch wired up to three wires.

    Most keyboards don't do half damper so they just use the same type of switch as a sustain pedal.

    If you can live without the half damper it should be easy enough to wire up a triple pedal with any standard set of pedals to work with the Casio.

    They haven't reinvented the laws of physics here, they've simply been a bunch of dicks about allowing third party hardware to be used with their keyboards.

    From what I've read about the SP-33 it's supposed to be a really flimsy piece of plasticky crap too aside from being impossible to fit under a standard X-Stand.

    Like I said, when it comes to pedals and stands, Casio are a bunch of dicks. :p

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 21, 2016
    #4
  5. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    In order to illustrate my point, here's what an industry standard set of pedals looks like in a schematic.

    Like I said, if a keyboard doesn't do half dampering it uses another sustain pedal instead with a TS connector.

    The Casio pedal has to look something like this internally. The only real question is what are they connected to?

    pedals-schem.jpg


    If we could figure that out we could attach any industry standard pedal to a Casio.

    If I could spend ten minutes with one with a multimeter I'd have my answer.

    If I had to guess, I'd say they probably share a common ground pin just for simplicity's sake.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 21, 2016
    #5
  6. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    Caloo! Calay! O Frabjous Day!!!

    I just discovered a PDF on how to hook up M-Audio Pedals to a Casio PX Piano!!!!

    Some decent angel out there has done the legwork!!!

    Here's the PDF.

    Use it in good health and hook up a decent set of pedals instead of that plastic Casio crap!@!!!

    Gary ;)
     

    Attached Files:

    happyrat1, Aug 21, 2016
    #6
  7. Greg Barker

    John Garside

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2016
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Wellingborough, UK
    Post from a complete newcomer to the forum:
    The other solution, which might be a little more straightforward to accomplish, that I've seen posted elsewhere, is where the SP33 was cut down to sit between the feet of a standard X-stand.
    Enough surplus was left so that the ends of the SP33 could be screwed down into holes drilled into the X-stand feet.
    The person, who used the rig for gigging, seemed well pleased with the result.
    The place I saw it was the official Casio forum in the PX-560 section here ... sorry I can't yet post a link.
    casiomusicforums the PX-560 section, thread about expression pedal.
    Any help?
    John.
     
    John Garside, Aug 23, 2016
    #7
  8. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    This is the post I believe you are referring to.

    http://www.casiomusicforums.com/ind...xpression-pedal/&do=findComment&comment=32513

    The only drawbacks that I see with this are

    1) The Casio pedals have a reputation for being very cheaply made with plastic hinges that fail way too soon.

    2) This approach locks your x-stand at a particular height so if your playing position varies between sitting and standing you will either have to drill more holes or lock yourself into a single playing position.

    I have been giving serious thought to selling off my Kurzweil and getting a PX-560 to replace it and I think if I were to approach the problem I'd do this.

    I'd use an M-Audio SP-triple which I already own, I wouldn't cut any cables like they did in the PDF, I'd ignore the half damper which I wouldn't really use and instead wire up an adapter cable that plugs directly into the Casio at one end and directly into the SP-triple at the other.

    That way there's no chopping, hacking or other implements of destruction being applied to my expensive gear and I can always reuse it with some other keyboard in the future.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 23, 2016
    #8
  9. Greg Barker

    John Garside

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2016
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Wellingborough, UK
    A little info. about the PS33 pedals.
    The connector to the underside of the PX-560 is one of those things that connects a small wiring loom onto a printed circuit board.
    A bit like the one that connects SATA drives to a PC motherboard.
    It has just five pins, with one of them having two wires connected to it. Earth?
    If I could find my multimeter (I moved house recently) I could work out which wire does what.
     
    John Garside, Aug 26, 2016
    #9
  10. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    Hi John.

    I sympathise with you about moving. I'm in the same process myself atm.

    If you manage to find your ohmmeter and can draw up a proper schematic it would be greatly appreciated.

    The PX-560 is looking like a very plausible option for me in the near future and I'd be grateful if you could draw up a proper schematic.

    The wiring photos in the PDF are very poorly marked and a proper schematic would remove a few ambiguities.

    BTW, if you can't locate your ohmmeter all you really need to test is continuity which can be easily tested with a couple of short lengths of wire, an AA alkaline battery and a flashlight bulb and a couple of alligator clips.

    If you could confirm the connections in the PDF file at least that would be quite helpful.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 28, 2016
    #10
  11. Greg Barker

    John Garside

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2016
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Wellingborough, UK
    Hi Gary,
    I'll try today to locate the box that I packed the multimeter in.
    We decided to do quite a bit of redecoration to the place, which has taken longer than I initially expected.
    At seventy, I find I don't have as much energy as I did the last time I took on another home. :-(
    But I will make an effort to find it.
    At first I couldn't work out which schematic you were referring to, but I imagine it's the one attached to your earlier post "pedal.pdf"?
    John.
     
    John Garside, Aug 28, 2016
    #11
  12. Greg Barker

    Greg Barker

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2016
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    San Luis Obispo, CA, USA
    Sorry to have been quiet, but I've been anchoring out on Santa Cruz Island off the Central California Coast and not had access to network services. It is still possible to escape the tyranny of the cell phone and email.

    Gary, thanks for the PDF. I agree that the M-Audio SP-Triple is the way to go. I'm about to head up to Lake Tahoe for a couple of weeks, and will bring the tools needed then on-line order supplies directly into where I'm staying. I'll report my results. I found the 5-pin jack on the bottom of my keyboard. I had missed it when I originally looked over the keyboard. The single pedal uses a 1/4" jack on the back of the keyboard.

    I probably won't mess with the short/long sustain. On my acoustic piano, which has a damper rather than a sostenuto pedal, I "feather" the sustain pedal to keep things from getting too "mushy" a couple of times on a Rachmaninoff prelude. With the sostenuto pedal, that will not be necessary. I'll just have to learn to vary my pedaling a bit on this one piece when moving between the piano and keyboard.
     
    Greg Barker, Aug 29, 2016
    #12
  13. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    Firstly I'll give you fair warning about the SP-Triple. The build quality of this pedal is nowhere near the weight and solidity of the SP-2.

    M-Audio seems to have cheaped out on the design of this pedal. If you are shelling out for new pedals you'd still be better off buying three SP-2s instead of the SP-Triple and attaching them to a solid sheet of masonite or plywood to keep them from sliding around.

    Building an adapter box to hook up directly to the plugs would still be the way to go though.

    I contacted the author of the PDF last night and found out that his design is 100% accurate and functional though. Still he gives enough information in the PDF to design a working adapter without the Half Damper connector.

    And I have changed my own mind about picking up a PX-560 and will instead get a PX-5S to replace my Kurzweil.

    The lack of a PC editor for the PX-560 is a total dealbreaker for me. Since the PX-5S lacks the Casio proprietary pedal connector I won't be needing to build my own adapter.

    Good luck with the project.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 29, 2016
    #13
  14. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

    Joined:
    May 30, 2012
    Messages:
    4,919
    Likes Received:
    1,560
    Location:
    GTA, Canada
    BTW, here's the URL of the original PDF should you require to contact the author.

    http://joflaherty.org/

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Aug 29, 2016
    #14
    1. Advertisements

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments (here). After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.
Similar Threads
  1. Laura

    guitar pedals with a keyboard?

    Laura, Feb 2, 2008, in forum: General Keyboard Discussion
    Replies:
    17
    Views:
    2,400
    JimRH8
    Jan 9, 2009
  2. Laura

    using guitar pedals

    Laura, Jun 6, 2008, in forum: General Keyboard Discussion
    Replies:
    12
    Views:
    1,778
    Terr-or Form
    Jun 8, 2008
  3. Nillerbabs

    Pedals and several boards

    Nillerbabs, Aug 8, 2008, in forum: General Keyboard Discussion
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    581
    Nillerbabs
    Aug 8, 2008
  4. evergreenthompson

    Which make/model pedals (specifically for M50)?

    evergreenthompson, Dec 17, 2008, in forum: Korg Keyboards
    Replies:
    10
    Views:
    4,174
    jpscoey
    Jan 28, 2009
  5. willthompson6359

    Expression Pedals

    willthompson6359, Jan 13, 2009, in forum: Keyboard Purchase Recommendations
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    1,097
    delaware dave
    Dec 31, 2013
  6. pickle

    Making My Own Pedals for Keyboard

    pickle, Mar 4, 2009, in forum: General Keyboard Discussion
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    674
    kanthos
    Mar 4, 2009
  7. Mozartian

    Casio WK7600 in the US - Casios response...

    Mozartian, Mar 26, 2013, in forum: Casio Keyboards
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    1,685
    Mozartian
    Mar 26, 2013
  8. Greg Barker

    Who wants portable triple pedals for Casio?

    Greg Barker, Sep 14, 2016, in forum: Casio Keyboards
    Replies:
    22
    Views:
    846
    Fred Coulter
    Oct 20, 2016
Loading...