Sending Midi CC messages for Program changes

[Scradley1960]

I'm using a Yamaha YC61 as mostly an organ, but a few other sounds, and a Roland Fantom 8 as my "main" lower board. I'd like to be able to pick from a setlist and have something (some box, my iPad??) send Program Change CCs to these two boards. THey're going to want different commands so I'm not sure how one would do this... Can anyone suggest help?
FYI - I use an Ipad for lyrics, chords and other info, and can send midi messages from it (I think!).
Brad

 

[TedS]

The Roland MIDI implementation is pretty well spelled-out in the manual, also in an appendix. Beyond that it will take some trial and error. I don't use my iPad for this purpose, so I can't recommend any apps. Sorry.

 

[happyrat1]

Most people use Mainstage to program setlists on iOS.

 

[anotherscott]

I'm using a Yamaha YC61 as mostly an organ, but a few other sounds, and a Roland Fantom 8 as my "main" lower board. I'd like to be able to pick from a setlist and have something (some box, my iPad??) send Program Change CCs to these two boards.

A Program Change is its own MIDI message, it is not a CC.

THey're going to want different commands so I'm not sure how one would do this... Can anyone suggest help?
FYI - I use an Ipad for lyrics, chords and other info, and can send midi messages from it (I think!).

Yes, you can use an iPad to select a song and have it send Program Changes to multiple attached keyboards. It can be done with either a MIDI routing app (like Keystage or Camelot Pro) or by a set list app (like Set List Maker with its MIDI IAP). Which app are you currently using for lyrics/chords? Check its manual to confirm whether/how it can be configured to send MIDI when you bring up a song, you may not need to buy another app at all.

You will need some way to connect both of your keyboards to your iPad. This can be done via either USB or 5-pin MIDI connections, and the exact connecting pieces you need will depend on whether your iPad has a lightning port or a USB-C. (There is also a wireless bluetooth option, e.g. CME's WIDI devices.)

As an aside, it is also possible to use the Fantom's Scenes such that, when you bring up an internal sound, it also changes the patch on an attached additional keyboard. You do this by including an EXTernal zone in the Scene. Since you don't want that external sound to play from the Roland's keys, you can set its key range to something beyond the playable keys on the keyboard. (There may be other ways to accomplish that goal as well.)

Most people use Mainstage to program setlists on iOS.

Mainstage does not run on iOS.

 

[Scradley1960]

A Program Change is its own MIDI message, it is not a CC.


Yes, you can use an iPad to select a song and have it send Program Changes to multiple attached keyboards. It can be done with either a MIDI routing app (like Keystage or Camelot Pro) or by a set list app (like Set List Maker with its MIDI IAP). Which app are you currently using for lyrics/chords? Check its manual to confirm whether/how it can be configured to send MIDI when you bring up a song, you may not need to buy another app at all.

You will need some way to connect both of your keyboards to your iPad. This can be done via either USB or 5-pin MIDI connections, and the exact connecting pieces you need will depend on whether your iPad has a lightning port or a USB-C. (There is also a wireless bluetooth option, e.g. CME's WIDI devices.)

As an aside, it is also possible to use the Fantom's Scenes such that, when you bring up an internal sound, it also changes the patch on an attached additional keyboard. You do this by including an EXTernal zone in the Scene. Since you don't want that external sound to play from the Roland's keys, you can set its key range to something beyond the playable keys on the keyboard. (There may be other ways to accomplish that goal as well.)


Mainstage does not run on iOS.

Thanks for that. What's weird is that I finally got the 08 to change scenes with Forscore, which is what I'm using on the iPad. I was going in the "EXT Device" USB input and I found an old printer cable and tried the "Computer" port instead and it worked. Except this morning now it doesn't. I didn't do anything but turn off the Roland keyboard.

I double checked the midi settings on the keyboard and nothing has changed. Very strange.

 

[Scradley1960]

A Program Change is its own MIDI message, it is not a CC.


Yes, you can use an iPad to select a song and have it send Program Changes to multiple attached keyboards. It can be done with either a MIDI routing app (like Keystage or Camelot Pro) or by a set list app (like Set List Maker with its MIDI IAP). Which app are you currently using for lyrics/chords? Check its manual to confirm whether/how it can be configured to send MIDI when you bring up a song, you may not need to buy another app at all.

You will need some way to connect both of your keyboards to your iPad. This can be done via either USB or 5-pin MIDI connections, and the exact connecting pieces you need will depend on whether your iPad has a lightning port or a USB-C. (There is also a wireless bluetooth option, e.g. CME's WIDI devices.)

As an aside, it is also possible to use the Fantom's Scenes such that, when you bring up an internal sound, it also changes the patch on an attached additional keyboard. You do this by including an EXTernal zone in the Scene. Since you don't want that external sound to play from the Roland's keys, you can set its key range to something beyond the playable keys on the keyboard. (There may be other ways to accomplish that goal as well.)


Mainstage does not run on iOS.

I will look at how to send the YC61 a Program Change from the Roland once I solve my other issue. Many thanks for this info.

 

[anotherscott]

Thanks for that. What's weird is that I finally got the 08 to change scenes with Forscore, which is what I'm using on the iPad. I was going in the "EXT Device" USB input and I found an old printer cable and tried the "Computer" port instead and it worked.

Right. Unlike 5-pin, each USB device must function as either a host (master) or a slave. Computers (USB-A connections until USB-C came along) are hosts, peripherals (the devices with USB-B connections, traditionally things like printers and hard drives) are slaves. In this case, the iPad is the computer (host), and must be connected to the Roland's USB-B (square) connection.

Except this morning now it doesn't. I didn't do anything but turn off the Roland keyboard.

I double checked the midi settings on the keyboard and nothing has changed. Very strange.

If you turned off the Roland, my guess is that terminated the connection to the iPad, and you may simply have to disconnect and reconnect the USB for it to be seen again.

I will look at how to send the YC61 a Program Change from the Roland once I solve my other issue. Many thanks for this info.

Just a tip for when you want to try that... physically, all it will require is a 5-pin MIDI cable from the Fantom's MIDI Out to the YC's MIDI In.

 

[Scradley1960]

If you turned off the Roland, my guess is that terminated the connection to the iPad, and you may simply have to disconnect and reconnect the USB for it to be seen again.

Hi Scott
I tried several times and even changed the cable and what was working the other night, now doesn't. Very confused.
Any other ideas are super duper appreciated!

 

[anotherscott]

Okay, you've disconnected/reconnected/changed all cabling, and restarted the Roland... Have you tried rebooting the iPad?

 

[Scradley1960]

Okay, you've disconnected/reconnected/changed all cabling, and restarted the Roland... Have you tried rebooting the iPad?

oh yes several times as well (Note: I'm an electronics engineering technologist by training) (-:

 

[Scradley1960]

Okay, you've disconnected/reconnected/changed all cabling, and restarted the Roland... Have you tried rebooting the iPad?

Check this out!!! I took the same cable I'm using to go from iPad to Fantom 08 and I put it into an OLD OLD OLD midi converter I had lying around. It takes the same USB in (the square one like a printer) and puts out 5 pin midi. When I put that between the iPad and the Fantom, it WORKS!!!!!! Took the same cable, and stuck it back in the Roland and no workie. So, good thing is i have a solution for tonight's gig, but still very perplexed.

 

[Stampanator]

I'm using a Yamaha YC61 as mostly an organ, but a few other sounds, and a Roland Fantom 8 as my "main" lower board. I'd like to be able to pick from a setlist and have something (some box, my iPad??) send Program Change CCs to these two boards. THey're going to want different commands so I'm not sure how one would do this... Can anyone suggest help?
FYI - I use an Ipad for lyrics, chords and other info, and can send midi messages from it (I think!).
Brad

 

[Stampanator]

I'm using a Yamaha YC61 as mostly an organ, but a few other sounds, and a Roland Fantom 8 as my "main" lower board. I'd like to be able to pick from a setlist and have something (some box, my iPad??) send Program Change CCs to these two boards. THey're going to want different commands so I'm not sure how one would do this... Can anyone suggest help?
FYI - I use an Ipad for lyrics, chords and other info, and can send midi messages from it (I think!).
Brad

I think keystage would work fine.

I have a Handy little util called mididesigner pro. But it requires some geekyness

 

[Dasntn]

I used BandHelper on an iPad to send changes to my two boards (Yamaha MX and CK). I'm a recent convert to Bandhelper but it is great - a very well engineered piece of software.

It syncs seamlessly between PC , Mac , ios and android, so I have everything on every device (handly if one fails). Does the usual Chords/Lyrics/Set lists for songs, but also sends out Midi program changes when you change songs. You can associate multiple Miid Changes with a song, and have them routed out on different Midi channels, so control multiple keyboards with a single selection of a song. bandhelp.com is the website