Which keyboard would be good for...

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- full 88 key and weighted keys
- comfortable
- quality piano sound as well as able to have a wide selection of other sounds, e.g., other instruments, syntheizer
- easy to use
- good options for exporting music
- good value
 
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One thing missing from your list is budget so if I assume up to $1500 US.

Checkout:-

Casio px s3000
Korg xe20
Casio px560
Yamaha dgx670
Roland fp60x
Roland rd88
Yamaha p515

DP’s under $800 do tend to have limited onboard sounds and if you were to consider these then :-

Korg D1
Casio PX S1000
Yamaha P125
Roland fp30x
Kawai es110
 
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- full 88 key and weighted keys
- comfortable
- quality piano sound as well as able to have a wide selection of other sounds, e.g., other instruments, syntheizer
- easy to use
- good options for exporting music
- good value
Well, that narorws it down to just about anything on the market these days...

There have been many different threads about this very thing in your query. My recommendation is to browse the threads, as they have much detailed information about this.

Overall, I would recommend looking at the Korg Kross 2-88, Roland Juno DS-88, and the Yamaha MODX-88.

Grace,
Harry
 
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Thanks Biggles. That's a lot to look at since I'm starting knowing nothing about any of them.

Harry, so they're all exactly equally good? Thanks for the suggestions, I don't see the MODX-88, only the MODX8 (at $2000).
 
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The MODX8 is the 88-key variant of the MODX line. I was using the -88 as the indicator of the keybed size.

I, personally, like the Kross2-88 the best, as it has everything you need to write/sequence/record music all in one box.

The Roland Juno DS-88 has great sounds, but is lacking the comprehensive sequencer feature that the Kross2 has.

The MODX is more of a performance synth and features some of the best Yamaha sounds to come out in a while. It is a consdensed down version of the Montage, but has gained footing on its own as a very capable synth. The Superknob is quite cool too, but the MODX lacks an internal sequencer.

The Kross2 has the least amount of RAM for its sounds (149Mb) but Korg have done a lot with that EDS-i engine in there and the sounds are quite good. For an all-around workstation, it is my pick. I have 4 of the Kross 1 units and I get A LOT of mileage out of them and the Kross 2 upped the ante on an entry-level workstation and its capability.

The price of the Roland Juno DS-88 is $1,199 USD at Sweetwater.
The price of the Yamaha MODX8 is $1,999 USD at Sweetwater.
The price of the Korg Kross2-88 is $1,299 USD at Sweetwater.

You can find these used as well ad the prices are even less...

Grace,
Harry
 
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Thanks. Actually those three are the reviews I've gotten started on. I wasn't familiar - and still really am not - with the 'performance' and 'workstation' roles, but suspect I'd want more 'workstation', no plans for any 'performance'.

The Kross had a lot that sounded very good about it, but two important areas were reviewed as 'ok, not that good', the quality of the included sounds and the feel of the keys, being 'sluggish'. That has me a little worried. It does sound easier to use which is good.

I checked ebay for used ones and didn't really find any, just the same list prices (even for used), there are probably other sites.
 
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Thanks. Actually those three are the reviews I've gotten started on. I wasn't familiar - and still really am not - with the 'performance' and 'workstation' roles, but suspect I'd want more 'workstation', no plans for any 'performance'.

The Kross had a lot that sounded very good about it, but two important areas were reviewed as 'ok, not that good', the quality of the included sounds and the feel of the keys, being 'sluggish'. That has me a little worried. It does sound easier to use which is good.

I checked ebay for used ones and didn't really find any, just the same list prices (even for used), there are probably other sites.
With the Kross 2, you are getting a weighted action. It is a basic weighted action, but it is weighted, nonetheless. I do not find my action sluggish at all. I also have a lady friend and I program some sounds for her on her Kross 2-88 which she bought new recently. I played it and it felt tight, but I suspect that it is because the keyboard was brand new. It will break in a bit and feel pretty good.

Unless you spend a lot of money on a high end synth, you are going to have basic weighted action.

The best action I have is on a Lowrey/Kawai digital piano and it is a joy to play. When I play live, I use the Kurzweil SP1 and the action is a joy to play as well. The piano sounds on it are terrible, but I use a Kross 1-61 for my main piano sounds anyway and simply MIDI the Kross to the Kurzy and it translates very well.

The Kross lacks a touch screen and there are a lot of button presses, but once you get the hang of it, it will become second nature to you.

I think that reviews are a mixed bag, in reality. Many people buy something that is lower cost and then poo-poo all over it because it does not have all of the feaures of the higher end offerings. I find that for the price, the Kross is a formidable instrument.

With Korg, and this is something that I have noticed on many of their products, is that initially, they sound dull. What you need to do is add a bit of Reverb and a little high end to the sounds and then the keyboard comes alive. I would say in my studio, about half of them are Korg products, spanning many years and many models. The piano sounds are pretty good and if you use the OASYS piano expansion library for the Kross 2, it really does sound good. With that said, I did end up modifying a few piano sounds for my friend on her Kross 2 to open them up a bit and make them better for live use.

Grace,
Harry
 
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I agree with Harry on the Korg which I also owned but mine was the 61 key version.

Whilst these workstation/synth do offer vast potential, one of your criteria is easy to use but this is not how I would describe using a workstation/synth.

The Korg is very easy to select sounds and to create a basic Combi (layered sounds) but then the vast and very extensive menu system comes to play so as Harry writes there is a lot of button pressing to do and a steep learning curve. I had one of the very first Kross 2 models and was not a fan of the piano sounds, even after I had made adjustments.

Korg released the Kross Neon range which had additional sounds including quite a lot of new pianos, after eighteen months a download was available and after I had installed them the Kross 2 became greatly enhanced. I am not sure if buying a new one will included the sound oack so that is something to check.

The steep learning curve would be a reasonable description of all this genre of keyboards, easy to use the basics but then becoming progressively more taxing.

The Yamaha MODX, is a keyboard I have tried and discounted due to its menu system and fir me the harsh tone of non piano instruments.

I played the Juno and the Kross back to back many times and for your recording requirement the Kross would be the best choice. The Juno had for me the slightly better piano sounds but overall they were very similar in tonality.

Do go to a music store and check out all keyboards in your budget.

Whilst we seem to be guiding you towards a Korg I do have to say that personally I would not buy an 88 key Korg Kross simply because I do not like the action, nor do I like any Korg keybed action in their lower cost digital pianos, both Roland and Yamaha have much superior keybeds. That said it is what suits you that matters hence my suggestion above.
 
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DP’s under $800 do tend to have limited onboard sounds and if you were to consider these then :-

Korg D1
Casio PX S1000
Yamaha P125
Roland fp30x
Kawai es110
For an 88-key hammer action DP with "wide selection of other sounds" in the under $800 category, there's the Casio CDP-S350.
 
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Biggle and I seem to agree on a lot of different points.

I certainly recommend that the OP tries all of them out and see which one really feels good under the fingers.

Based on my experience with Roland (which is almost as substantial as with Korg), I have found their pianos to lack a bit compared to Korg and Yamaha, epecially Yamaha. I have found Roland pianos to be a bit bright and almost hollow in their sound. The only real exception to me would be the V-Piano, but since that employs a different tech than the Juno, I will not go into details. I imagine that the newest Fantom is the same way when compared to the Juno. I found the Juno DS-88 to be a good instrument, but the pianos, even the ones you can download into it, to lack something that did not connect with me. I also did not like the textured keys and they distracted me a bit. I suppose that if I bought it, I would get used to it, since I can adapt to any keybed.

With the Yamaha MODX8, Yamaha is going to reign over all others with their piano sounds. Yamaha has been making pianos for over 125 years and it is a given (at least to me) that their piano sounds are always going to be good. The performance features of the MODX8 are good and it is hard to ignore that Superknob for making subtle or drastic changes to a sound when playing live. The FM engine means a lot to different people and I, for one, like the sound of FM when mixed right with the samples sounds. It gives a neat texture to one's sound. Another thing about the Yamaha pianos, I use a Yamaha C5 Grand sample pack in my Korg PA700 as the main piano sound when I play that... that should say something about Yamaha's pianos.

The 'workstation' aspect of the Kross makes it stand out. You can write a song, start to finish, on the Kross. You can even record audio over your sequenced song and it will be in WAV format. You can plug in a mic, add EFX to it, and have a full production. The Kross 2 also acts as a USB Audio Interface with your PC. With that said, you do not need a computer to write a song on it. It has everything you need to write a song.

The Roland Juno-DS has a USB Audio Interface too, but with the phrase sequencer, it does not have the functionality of the Kross 2 in that regard as a stand-alone unit.

The Yamaha MODX does not have a sequencer, but probably has the most comprehensive USB Audio Interface of all three synths. If computer integration is big for you, then the Yamaha may be the way to go. It also features more polyhony than the other two. Between the AWM2 samples and the FM-X engine, you get a total of 192 notes of polyphony. The Roland Juno DS has 128 notes, and the Kross 2 has 120 notes. When composing big songs with a lot of parts, or performing with a huge Combi, polyphony is very important.

Any three of these would be a winner for anyone, but if you really want everything in one box, the Kross 2 is really the only one that meets that criteria. Another thing to consider about the Kross - there is a PC editor that you can use that virtually eliminates the button presses. You can program right from the editor if you want to and that makes things substantially easier on the Kross. The program can be a stand-alone program or a plugin in your favorite DAW program.

I was just composing a song on my Kross 1-88 last evening with some custom patches I programmed. It worked well, but there are a lot of button presses to get it done. I chose a program, hit the record button, and started playing. I then armed another track, but I recorded that track from my Korg M50, because of the custom lead guitar sound I have on there. I was able to record the guitar part, whilst playing the M50, into the Kross 1. I set that track to external, so the Kross would not play an internal sound on that track and only trigger the lead guitar on the M50. I also added a third track, a synth bass pulse type thing, and it worked very well. It literally was that easy. I could control my entire keyboard setup in the studio (comprising of over 25 synths) from the Kross 1 if I want to.

Check all three keyboards out. Watch the videos on YouTube about each one. They are all worthy investments. It is a great time to be alive in the synth world :)

Grace,
Harry
 

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The difference in pianos that you mention can usually be altered with a bit of tweaking of the FX and EQ and envelope controls.

I find Korg generally goes overboard with the FX and EQ in their factory settings and that's why they sound "brighter" than the Rolands.

As far as sequencers goes, does anyone still do all their sequencing on the keyboard? That's what computers are for.

And personally I prefer the Juno DS88 Keyboard to the Kross 2 88.

Gary ;)
 
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Thinking about Korg then for only $250 more than the Kross 2 88 the Op could consider a Krome Ex 88, where the huge advantage over the Kross 2 would be with the inclusion of the Touch-view LCD screen.

$1550 at Sweetwater.
 
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The MODX...is a consdensed down version of the Montage, but has gained footing on its own as a very capable synth. The Superknob is quite cool too, but the MODX lacks an internal sequencer.
Sequencer was added in OS 2.0 (and further updated in 2.5)... but it's still not a full linear compositional sequencer as you'd find in the Kross. The MODX does have all the sounds of the Montage, but cuts back in a number of areas, like fewer front panel controls, plastic chassis with external power supply, lesser action with no aftertouch, seamless sound switching limited to sets of 4 parts rather than 8, and so forth.

I wasn't familiar - and still really am not - with the 'performance' and 'workstation' roles, but suspect I'd want more 'workstation', no plans for any 'performance'.
Harry's comments have focussed largely on the workstation aspects (comparing the boards based on their sequencer functions, and things like "writing a song from start to finish" and "everything in one box"), but I'm not sure anything in your OP actually indicates a need for that... the closest is "good options for exporting music." Do you intend to use the board to create multitrack, arranged compositions (whether of your own songs, or covers)? By mulitrack I mean, you lay down one part at a time... for example, first you do the piano part, then you add a drum part, then you add a bass part, etc. etc. until you have recorded a complete song? If that's your goal, you want a workstation. If that's not your goal, and "easy to use" is a priority as you put at the top, then I would say you probably do not want a workstation, or even the not-quite-a-workstation boards like Juno DS and MODX, which have lesser sequencers but are still very deep and versatile (and therefore also somewhat complicated) boards. Maybe you can explain a little more about what you're trying to do in terms of "exporting music"? It's possible that something closer to the "digital piano" kind of board than the "workstation" kind of board may be more suitable for you.

And although it's been touched on sideways, do you have a particular budget in mind?
 
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I do not find my action sluggish at all. I also have a lady friend and I program some sounds for her on her Kross 2-88 which she bought new recently. I played it and it felt tight, but I suspect that it is because the keyboard was brand new. It will break in a bit and feel pretty good.
I'm not sure it's about breaking in, I think there may actually be variation in the actions Korg uses. I had a thread about this at http://forums.musicplayer.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2692290/korg-kross-vs-krome-action

When I play live, I use the Kurzweil SP1 and the action is a joy to play as well. The piano sounds on it are terrible, but I use a Kross 1-61 for my main piano sounds anyway and simply MIDI the Kross to the Kurzy and it translates very well.
If someone wants the SP1 feel but with a much stronger sound and feature set, check out the SP6. I'm pretty sure it has the same action. The SP1 is notable, though, in being perhaps the least expensive hammer action 88 with 5-pin MIDI jacks and pitch/mod wheels and any sounds at all. And under 30 lbs. I think anything at or below its price even without sounds is either heavier and/or has a less appealing action. It's too bad the sounds aren't better, it's got an appealing interface. The front panel MIDI controls are a nice touch.
 

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I second Scott's suggestion of the Kurzweil SP6. It's the same generation of sound creation as the other items mentioned and the keybed is excellent.

Gary ;)
 

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Hey Scott? What about a Casio PX-5S? I think they are still in production these days? Everything else could be handled with an iPad and VSTis. It would be a lot cheaper and make a kickass budget hybrid system. If it comes down to the best feeling keybeds and value for dollar, then I think it would fit the bill.

Gary ;)
 
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The thing is I agree with Harry, Scott and Gary and going by the original listed requirements a workstation/synth does not necessarily match the requirements.

A lower priced digital piano has very few sounds, some like the Casio CDP S350 that Scott quoted and those that I suggested in particular the Casio S3000, Korg XE20 & Yamaha DGX670 have plenty of onboard tones, and unlike the Kross 2 and Juno etc they have onboard amp and speakers.

Go the Kross 2 or Juno route or indeed with any synth/workstation and you will need to factor in for adding a pair of Monitor speakers at about $200 for a pair.

There is to me a big advantage of going with either a Casio CDP S350, a Casio S3000, a Korg XE20 or a Yamaha DGX670 is that in addition to plenty of onboard sounds they have Arranger functions (auto accompaniment) which is a very nice and useful feature to have with a home keyboard.

Gary quoted using an iPad and this is what I have been doing for a few years now, there are hundreds of very easy to use Apps available that can turn even the cheapest Digital Piano into a very versatile keyboard. On my own iPad I have about 10 different synths, five digital pianos, a drawbar organ, a looper, an Arranger app and a brace of DAWS which include full orchestral sounds.

So having Synth Apps will help in learning how to use a Synth but eventually there will come a time when the lure of better adjustment via knobs, buttons and sliders will cone to the fore and this is the stage that I am at.

Polyphony, this is the number of notes that a keyboard can play at the same time and this is where a digital piano will blitz a keyboard/synth which typically have a polyphony of 128 whereas a digital piano will have twice this amount. What this means is that with a very full piece a workstation/synth could start to drop notes as the polyphony limit is reached. So bear this in mind in determining what will be your future requirements of your keyboard.
 
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If someone wants the SP1 feel but with a much stronger sound and feature set, check out the SP6. I'm pretty sure it has the same action. The SP1 is notable, though, in being perhaps the least expensive hammer action 88 with 5-pin MIDI jacks and pitch/mod wheels and any sounds at all. And under 30 lbs. I think anything at or below its price even without sounds is either heavier and/or has a less appealing action. It's too bad the sounds aren't better, it's got an appealing interface. The front panel MIDI controls are a nice touch.
The Kurzweil appealed to me because it had an interface that very few keyboards have ever had. I am reminded of the GEM models that offered individual control over each 'section' and since I perform live, that was an instant selling point. If it had great pianos, that would have been a bonus because I could have left the Korg Kross at home. Since it does not, I am still bringing the Kross to the gig, but I can use the 61-key model instead of the 88 for the Kross and that helps load-in and load-out. The other sounds on the Kurzy are still good, so if anything, I get even ANOTHER layering opportunity when using the EPs and Strings on the Kurzy AND from the Kross (and whatever else I may have MIDIed to it). The action on the SP1 is a joy and it really works well live. Yeah, 5-pin MIDI still means a lot to me and anything I buy HAS to have that for my needs. I know that we are all different.

I looked at the SP6 for a while too, but the 'too obvious' layout of the SP1 won me over. It is not that I cannot handle menus, it is that I like to make changes in real time and for my needs, the layout of the SP1 did just that.

Part of the reason that I am strong on the Kross units is because of their price point versus features. It really offers something that few others can offer. People almost always want to progress past where they initially say they want to be, and the Kross offers what they would need in a an all-in-one package. I think that the OP also needs to keep in mind that the more they want to do, the more complexity is involved. With that, the 'ease of use' desire is going to lessen. I am glad that you pointed that out as well.

I will admit that I have not spent a bunch of time with the Roland Juno DS series, but I have spent enough time to know what would work for me. I have spent even less time with the Yamaha MODX and it shows because I was not aware that they offered the update that offered some kind of sequencing. I was aware of the update to the Montage, but not the MODX.

Part of the reason I have not talked about any Casio products is that very few of them zing me to the point where I would want to recommend one, especially in a professional setting. If I had to recommend one, it would be the PX-5S. It is the only one I would consider placing on stage with me. Most of that has to do with its use of the 5-pin MIDI jacks on board. I have little to no use for USB MIDI and so anything I find that has that gets thrown out of the ring for me if that is its only form of MIDI connectivity. I have owned some Privia models in the past and the action was pretty good.

I am sure that the OP would be happy with ANY of the three that we've talked about. I do agree that I think that we need more information as to the intended use of the product, as we can narrow the offerings down a bit further. Even more so, having a ballpark price in mind would help narrow it down even better.

I really like this thread :)

Grace,
Harry
 
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Hey Scott? What about a Casio PX-5S? I think they are still in production these days?
PX-5S is a great board... though for the bullet list in the OP, I think the PX-560 would be a better (and easier to use) choice. For other uses, the PX-5S is better (and cheaper)... it's much better as a MIDI controller, for example. A good comparison is at https://casiomusicgear.wordpress.com/2016/01/11/the-definitive-px-5s-vs-px-560-comparison/

The Kurzweil appealed to me because it had an interface that very few keyboards have ever had. I am reminded of the GEM models that offered individual control over each 'section' and since I perform live, that was an instant selling point. If it had great pianos, that would have been a bonus because I could have left the Korg Kross at home. Since it does not, I am still bringing the Kross to the gig, but I can use the 61-key model instead of the 88 for the Kross and that helps load-in and load-out.
Alternatively, use that nice MIDI section of the SP1 control surface to integrate a piano from an iPad (or other iOS device)... There are numerous piano apps, but Korg pianos themselves are available in the Korg Module app, which even includes a couple of optional "Ivory" pianos (from Synthology). You'll probably end up with better-than-Kross pianos and save having to bring a second board at all! Though it's nice to have the backuyp of a second board, just in case of disaster.

I agree, the "section" approach is nice. The Yamaha CP73/CP88 have that in spades, and it is a joy to work with those boards. Different price range, though.

Part of the reason I have not talked about any Casio products is that very few of them zing me to the point where I would want to recommend one, especially in a professional setting. If I had to recommend one, it would be the PX-5S. It is the only one I would consider placing on stage with me. Most of that has to do with its use of the 5-pin MIDI jacks on board.
The PX-560 I mentioned above also has the 5-pin MIDI. And in fact, it has a 16-track linear sequencer, which the PX-5S does not, though not as sophisticated as Korg's. I think the PX-560 hits a particularly nice sweet spot between having a lot of functionality, yet still being a pretty easy board to use. The touchscreen interface is really nice.
 

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