WK 500 - AC7 file - Rhythm

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Hi There,
I just bought a Casio Wk 500 and I need to create my own Rhythm. I need a specific Persian 6/8 Rhythm.

I know I should had bought a model which has "Pattern Sequencer" (ie, WK7500) but I realized this too late. My mistake was when I looked at the WK 500's manual before buying and I saw "Edit Auto Accompaniment" feature, and I thought that is the feature I need but it was too late when I realized that I just can only use one of the existing parts of the existing Rhythms (Drum/Bass/etc) to edit the current one. So ie. I can not play my drum and have it recorded and then use it as a drum part in the Rhythm :(

I would return it and get a 7500 instead if I were in US but I a have imported it from US to Canada and the shipping was very expensive. so I have to pay the shipping back too if I want to return, so this does not work for me.

If I could make my rhythm in Midi and then convert it to AC7 format ( which is the format that this device reads as Rhythms and not the CKF) then that would be great. I have spent quite a time to find a solution for this but no luck so far.

Does anybody knows:

1- How to create a Midi rhythm ( with Channels 9-10-11-12-13) ? Which free software I can use ( sorry if its a dummy question but I have not used a midi software yet )
2- How can I convert the Midi file to AC7 file? The casio convertor application does concert it to CKF and not to AC7 and ckf is not useful for this model.
3- How can I transfer the AC7 file to the Keyboard? Can I just copy it to the SDcard and then read it to the keyboard?

Any help is much appreciated!

Thank you,

Shaya
 

The Y_man

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Hi Shaya,

There is a chance the CKF will work - Casio usually don't advertise this fact.

This is how I do it on my CTK-7000 (WK7500 equivalent). By the way don't feel so bad - the pattern sequencer on the 7500 isn't all that flash.....


To create a rhythm file from a MIDI file I do the following (may not be best method, but I don't know any other way yet!):

- use anvil studios to create the midi file. http://www.anvilstudio.com/


- download and install the IDES from http://www.casio-europe.com/euro/emi/cms/

- Use the IDES to conver a midi file to CKF using the "rhythm converter"

- Use Datamanager 5 to copy over to keyboard user rhythm segment. http://support.casio.com/download.php?cid=008&pid=340&rgn=5

Good luck!

The Y-man
 
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I went to the casio site and seen some new rhythms on the Special Rhythms section in .ac7 format. Is there a way to convert them to .ckf or to smf ?
 
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Thanks very much Y-man,

Yes - the work around worked! so I went through the entire process as you mentioned and I was able to upload the own generated test midi file ( converted to CFK ) to WK500.

The only issue is since I am a newbie I do not know how to Anvil to create the appropriate rhythm pattern. I was able to create something as drums but I do not know:
1- how it can be sequenced ( like a pattern sequence ) when I put elements of the drums in the composer it goes for ever so I do not know how to make it repeat as a sequence.
2- The rhythm that I created as a test went to the "Intro" part of the Auto Accompaniment so I am not sure how to handle this ( how can I specify which part I am making rhythms for it . ie : Intro/Normal/Fill in / etc )

I took a look at the Anvil guide/help but it does not specify this things.

Is there a pattern or template ( for Midi ) for a casio Auto accompaniment which I can use ( open it in Anvil and then modify it to mine )?

Thank you again Y-man. Much appreciate it.

Regards, Shaya
 

The Y_man

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Is there a pattern or template ( for Midi ) for a casio Auto accompaniment which I can use ( open it in Anvil and then modify it to mine )?

Whoooa :eek:.... I was going to convert a few and send it to you Victor, but there are so many!

In answer to you questions, the only way I have found so far is to:

1. Load the AC7 using Datamanager to the keyboards User Rhythm Section

2. Use the Song Recorder (Sequencer) function on my Casio to record the intro, normal, normal fill-in, var, var fill-in, and ending using a C major chord.

3. Save the recorded "song" as a SMF on the SD card.

4. Bring SD card over to computer.

I know.... bit clumsy.

I tried the way someone suggested some time ago to just play the rhythm over MIDI while having a sequencing software on the computer in record mode, but it looks like the Rhythm notes don't get transmitted across MIDI.....

The Y-man
 

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The only issue is since I am a newbie I do not know how to Anvil to create the appropriate rhythm pattern. I was able to create something as drums but I do not know:
1- how it can be sequenced ( like a pattern sequence ) when I put elements of the drums in the composer it goes for ever so I do not know how to make it repeat as a sequence.
2- The rhythm that I created as a test went to the "Intro" part of the Auto Accompaniment so I am not sure how to handle this ( how can I specify which part I am making rhythms for it . ie : Intro/Normal/Fill in / etc )

I took a look at the Anvil guide/help but it does not specify this things.
Hi SHaya,

I know - it took me a while to figure out.

I created a document with screenshots, but I can't upload here (tyoo large). PM me your email adress, I will email it to you.





Also, have a look at the user manual in IDES
See IDES instrucitons link at http://www.casio-europe.com/euro/emi/cms/


The Y-man
 
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The rhythm DOES get transmitted over MIDI. Don't know about your model, but on my WK-3800 I press on Transpose, then down arrow, right arrow, select AC/SNG ON.
This tells the keyboard to send the Accompaniment.

Y_Man, no problems, if you can't record all of the rhythms into MIDI, record fewer that sound better....when you have time :)
 

The Y_man

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The rhythm DOES get transmitted over MIDI. Don't know about your model, but on my WK-3800 I press on Transpose, then down arrow, right arrow, select AC/SNG ON.
This tells the keyboard to send the Accompaniment.

Thanks Victor - I think I got it. :) I left my board at the church tonight so I'll give it a shot tomorrow when I get back.

The Y-man
 
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Hi Shaya,

There is a chance the CKF will work - Casio usually don't advertise this fact.

This is how I do it on my CTK-7000 (WK7500 equivalent). By the way don't feel so bad - the pattern sequencer on the 7500 isn't all that flash.....


To create a rhythm file from a MIDI file I do the following (may not be best method, but I don't know any other way yet!):

- use anvil studios to create the midi file. http://www.anvilstudio.com/


- download and install the IDES from http://www.casio-europe.com/euro/emi/cms/

- Use the IDES to conver a midi file to CKF using the "rhythm converter"

- Use Datamanager 5 to copy over to keyboard user rhythm segment. http://support.casio.com/download.php?cid=008&pid=340&rgn=5

Good luck!

The Y-man
Y Man
Questions:
1)Are you saying that one can create rhythm pattern from MIDI track?
2)Which IDEAS should one use? They do not mention WK 7500?
3) yOU ARE MENTIONING ckf - but WK 7500 has AC.7 extension. IS this the same?
4) Do I need to use data manager. I'm not good with it. Can I copy the style to SD card and load from there? This is the method I'm familiar with.

If this works...
I'd be greatefull and much obliged

THNX in advance

Marjan
 

The Y_man

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1)Are you saying that one can create rhythm pattern from MIDI track?
2)Which IDEAS should one use? They do not mention WK 7500?
3) yOU ARE MENTIONING ckf - but WK 7500 has AC.7 extension. IS this the same?
4) Do I need to use data manager. I'm not good with it. Can I copy the style to SD card and load from there? This is the method I'm familiar with.

OK, I just went and checked the site - looks like IDES 4 has been removed.... :oops:

1. yes you were able to create rhythm files from MIDI - but it was limited to 4 channels (1 x drum, 3 x instrument)
2. v4 (I think - it is on my other laptop)
3. From memory AC7 is a dump of all settings (keyboard registers, rhythms, tones etc). There are different files created if you just want rhythm file.
4. Yes - if we can find the converter.


Casio does have a SMF (standard midi file converter) on their site, but I couldn't get it working for my CTK...

The Y-man
 
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From Page 136 of the WK-7500 manual:

Supported Data Types (File Types):

Rhythm Data: AC7
Tone Data: TN7
Drawbar Organ ToneData: DB7
DSP Data: DS7
Music Preset Data: MPS
Song Sequencer Data: CMS/MID
Registration Date: RM7
Data Dump (All Data): AL7



Y_man

I sent you a PM regarding this thread.
 
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Hi All,

After reading this post I am not sure if there is currently any software out there in cyberspace that will
actually convert a Midi file in to a .AC7 format that can be loaded directly via Data Manager 6.1
into a CTK7200 ? can anyone clear this up for me . George
 
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George

I think this "myth" probably had its origins in the fact that the IDES software (predecessor to Data Manager) that was bundled with the older Casio arrangers (up through the WK-3300/3800/8000) contained three accessory stand-alone modules - a tone editor, a rhythm converter, and a wave converter. The rhythm converter would accept a properly formatted Standard MIDI File phrase and generate a .ckf rhythm file that could be loaded into a User Rhythm slot on the keyboard. The IDES software was model specific and will not communicate with the newer (CTK-6000/6500/WK-7000/7200/7500/7600) models, but the stand-alone modules would run without having a keyboard connected. The fact that some of us have been successful in loading .ckf rhythm files from the older boards into the newer models indicates that there is at least some level of compatibility. That being the case, it may be possible to convert a MIDI file using the old IDES software and then load the resulting .ckf file into one of the newer boards. The problem would be in locating a copy of the IDES software. Casio continued to offer it for download for a while after the newer units were released, but it was removed from their download sites some time ago. Perhaps, if there is enough demand, they would repost it somewhere.

I must say that the output of the Rhythm Converter was typically quite primitive when compared to the professionally engineered Casio preset rhythms and the after market rhythm files offered on the official Casio websites. It was most useful for generating custom drum and bass phrases, but even so, I find it very ironic that, at a time when Casio is trying to improve the professional image of their hardware, they drop, rather than update or enhance, a couple of pieces of software that could have bolstered that image no end.
 
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Hi All,

After reading this post I am not sure if there is currently any software out there in cyberspace that will
actually convert a Midi file in to a .AC7 format that can be loaded directly via Data Manager 6.1
into a CTK7200 ? can anyone clear this up for me . George






You can convert MIDI to CKF

1. Set up a MIDI file, I use Cubase and set markers

2. I export the file as General MIDI

3. Important: You need to set 11 markers Intro 1 & 2, Var 1&2, Fil1 -4, End 1 and 2. Since the one I use ( WK 7500) has 1 intro, 1 end, and 2 variations, I just copy them twice.

4. Open the software Music Data Management Software

5. Click the second box –Rhythm Converter

6. File open, Open SMF ( Previously set)

7. Then go to Command: Convert to Pattern ( It is 5 th in the file drop menu)

8. It will create CKF file

9. Wk 7500 reads ckf as if it was AC.7 files, so you can load it directly on the media card and then load it as user rhytm.
 
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Mayo

I would be interested in knowing what version of Data Manager you are using. Neither of the Versions 6.0 or 6.1 I have offer a "Rhythm Converter" option. I suspect that you are using the old IDES 4 software that did offer that option, and that is the problem for folks like George. They did not have an older model that came with IDES 4 and it appears that it is no longer available for download. If you have IDES 4, then the procedure is exactly as you described, but if you do not have access to IDES 4, then you won't get very far as you will not have anything to convert the MIDI file to a .ckf file. That is why I said in my previous post that we need to put pressure on Casio (Mike Martin ?) to repost the IDES 4 software somewhere for owners of the new models.
 
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