Roland VR-09 Expression/Volume Pedal

[ryankeane11]

Hey everyone! I have a multi-keyboard rig in my studio. One of my favorites is the Roland VR-09 because of it's low cost and drawbar functionality for organs. I've been having trouble because I am using an M-Audio Expression/Volume pedal specifically for volume. I've tried all different settings in the internal keyboard functionality, but no matter what I've selected, going from heel all the way down to pressed all the way forward, the volume of the organ BARELY increases/decreases.

Is there any pedal that will work with this keyboard where I can get from complete silence to full volume on a full swing of the pedal?

I tried my other expression Yamaha FC-7 pedal but read about the different wiring that makes that pedal incompatible. I should note that I do not want to do any soldering or adjusting or anything, looking for a ready-made pedal where I can do this. Any suggestions?

 

[delaware dave]

Purchase an adapter that switches the tip and the ring on one end of the plug. M-Audio uses 'Yahama' logic ( the wiper which measures the change is assigned to the tip) where Roland uses 'Roland' logic ( the wiper which measures the change is assigned to the ring). Since M-Audio uses Yamaha logic and the FC7 also uses Yamaha logic the results will be similar. It needs Roland logic. To achieve this you need to flip the tip and ring wires on one end of the plug, converting the logic.

read this article (2 minute read): http://barrysmixedreviews.blogspot.com/2008/09/barrys-mixed-reviews-yamaha-fc7_313.html

Half way down the article he shows you how to do the simple switching of tip and ring using two stereo y-jack adapter cables together and reversing their connections (the red connecting to the black and vice versa). The cool thing about this particular solution is that when you use the adapter you have Roland logic and when you remove the adapter you have Yamaha logic.

Here are the two adapters that you need:

link 1

link 2

 

[ryankeane11]

Thank you for the description!!

I’ve been reading in a couple places that even with this fix, the pedal will still not bring the Roland VR-09 to fully silent and that the swing in the keyboard settings does not adjust very much at all. Some people have mentioned that a Moog pedal works better - but does anyone have any specific experience with this keyboard and a Yamaha FC-7 pedal? Will it go to full silent and loud with a full throw of the pedal?

If not the Yamaha, any other pedals that have been tried and tested to go to full silent and full loud with a full swing of an expression/volume pedal?

 

[anotherscott]

I’ve been reading in a couple places that even with this fix, the pedal will still not bring the Roland VR-09 to fully silent and that the swing in the keyboard settings does not adjust very much at all. Some people have mentioned that a Moog pedal works better - but does anyone have any specific experience with this keyboard and a Yamaha FC-7 pedal? Will it go to full silent and loud with a full throw of the pedal?

If not the Yamaha, any other pedals that have been tried and tested to go to full silent and full loud with a full swing of an expression/volume pedal?

There are two issues here.

One is that, if the expression pedal on an organ is functioning authentically, it should NEVER go to silent. The pedal on actual Hammonds didn't work that way... and it would be undersirable since Hammond technique can involve "playing" the pedal forexpression, and you do not want your sound to accidentally cut out completely! That said, some keyboards do provide ways to alter this behavior. For other sounds, though, yes, the expression pedal should typically function as a volume pedal, which includes going to silent. So that's one question to look at... when you say it will not go to silent, is that on ALL sounds, or only on organ? If it's only on organ, that would be indicative of authentic design on Roland's part. If it's on all sounds, then you have a problem.

Problem two is the very small amount of swing, i.e. a small "active" range where the pedal appears to be doing anything at all. This is discussed in depth at https://v-combo.webspace.rocks/expression-pedal

 

[ryankeane11]

Thank you for your reply. I know that full silent is inauthentic for an actual B3. But nonetheless it’s the volume style I’m looking for.

Looking at that article, does this mean that no pedal will be able to provide the functionality I’m looking for without going into the soldering process?

 

[anotherscott]

Thank you for your reply. I know that full silent is inauthentic for an actual B3. But nonetheless it’s the volume style I’m looking for.

If nothing else, you can always get that by putting a regular analog volume pedal on the output of the VR. Though that won't give you the other tonal/overdrive change that comes with using an expression pedal to control the organ volume, so if you lose authenticity on one way (the ability to silence the sound), you may be losing authenticity in another as well. Or I suppose you could use both, where the standard pedal operates as on the real thing, and you still have another pedal for overall volume, which could then reduce the volume alone regardless of the tonal sound you've created with the standard pedal.

 

[ryankeane11]

Oh that's an interesting solution. I never thought about a double pedal solution with one for the expression and one for overall full volume. That sounds like it might be the ticket. I just watched a Sweetwater video about the Boss FV-500L but was wondering if you had any suggestions for a potentially less expensive pedal?

Willing to spend money on something good, but also know that there tends to be great low-cost solutions for the same general quality. Thank you for all your help!

 

[delaware dave]

If you set the expression pedal to send CC#11 it will act as a Hammond pedal, which does not completely quiet the keyboard mimicing a Hammond which also does not completely go silent . The pedal also creates an EQ curve that in addition to raising the overall volume up and down (not drastically) it also raises the bass and treble up and down more than the overall volume; it also triggers more 'distortion' as you floor the pedal. If you set the expression pedal to send CC#7 it will act strictly as a volume pedal and will cause the program to go silent when the pedal is up, assuming your pedal actually goes to midi value = 0 and will go full volume when the pedal is down, assuming the pedal can reach midi value = 127. Depending on the flexibility of the VR09 programming you might be able to create two distinct programs where in one case the pedal = CC#11 and in the other case the pedal =CC#7. This way you don't have to invest in another piece of hardware. You could also set the pedal to CC#11 and when you want the organ to go silent move the master volume control on the face of the VR09 to 0.

 

[anotherscott]

If you set the expression pedal to send CC#11 it will act as a Hammond pedal..If you set the expression pedal to send CC#7 it will act strictly as a volume pedal

Does the VR09 provide that ability to set the pedal to your choice of CC#? The manual doesn't say so... but the manual looks like the expression pedal settings section may be wrong anyway, since it seems to be a direct copy-and-paste of the setting section for the sustain pedal, even saying that the "expression" setting makes it function as a damper pedal which doesn't make much sense!

 

[delaware dave]

Does the VR09 provide that ability to set the pedal to your choice of CC#?

I don't know, this is why I wrote "..Depending on the flexibility of the VR09 programming..", if it does then it is an option.

Funny thing about the manual that you saw; I had some early issues with the PC3 based on what I read in the manual and when I pinged Jean about them he told me that manual was incorrect; those pieces were apparently copied from the K2600 but a change occurred in design and the PC3 manual never was rewritten. Makes you wonder....

 

[jmemcse]

Hey everyone! I have a multi-keyboard rig in my studio. One of my favorites is the Roland VR-09 because of it's low cost and drawbar functionality for organs. I've been having trouble because I am using an M-Audio Expression/Volume pedal specifically for volume. I've tried all different settings in the internal keyboard functionality, but no matter what I've selected, going from heel all the way down to pressed all the way forward, the volume of the organ BARELY increases/decreases.

Is there any pedal that will work with this keyboard where I can get from complete silence to full volume on a full swing of the pedal?

I tried my other expression Yamaha FC-7 pedal but read about the different wiring that makes that pedal incompatible. I should note that I do not want to do any soldering or adjusting or anything, looking for a ready-made pedal where I can do this. Any suggestions?

I use these on all my keyboards - https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/EB6165--ernie-ball-6165-500k-stereo-volume-pan-pedal

 

[williamwill]

Hey everyone! I have a multi-keyboard rig in my studio. One of my favorites is the Roland VR-09 because of it's low cost and drawbar functionality for organs. I've been having trouble because I am using an M-Audio Expression/Volume pedal specifically for volume. I've tried all different settings in the internal keyboard functionality, but no matter what I've selected, going from heel all the way down to pressed all the way forward, the volume of the organ BARELY increases/decreases.

Is there any pedal that will work with this keyboard where I can get from complete silence to full volume on a full swing of the pedal?

I tried my other expression Yamaha FC-7 pedal but read about the different wiring that makes that pedal incompatible. I should note that I do not want to do any soldering or adjusting or anything, looking for a ready-made pedal where I can do this. Any suggestions?

 

[williamwill]

Read the manual for the capabilities of your keyboard if you believe you cannot find the answer in the manual contact Roland support

 

[ptooner]

My Yamaha pedal works just fine as is with my VR09 for expression. It is not a volume pedal.