Running 2 Midi Devices Without iInterfering With Each Other

Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
Well I tried posting this on the PreSonus Forum but no one has responded so I figured I would try my luck here because I'm getting good feedback.

I'm new to this and need a little help. I am running Studio One 3.2 Pro and I have an Alesis VI25 that I'll be using for various instruments and just purchased a KAT Multipad that I also want to have active for getting a more realistic feel to some drum sounds in Steven Slate Platinum 4. I would actually like to be able to use them both in tandem to build different parts of a drum track. Using the KAT MP only for certain parts of the track and the Alesis for other parts in the drum track. Both triggering the SSD4 sounds, I only want to use the KAT MP to trigger SSD4, I don't care for it's sounds.

Not sure how to setup the MIDI channels, split or whatever I need to do so they won't interfere with each others ports while not having either device being limited because another device is active.. Could someone please help me out with this? Thank you!
 

happyrat1

Destroyer of Eardrums!!!
Joined
May 30, 2012
Messages
13,885
Reaction score
5,581
Location
GTA, Canada
You can only have one device talking on one channel at a given time.

A workaround would be to record the drum track on channel 10 first with the Alesis and then overlay on the same track afterward in layer mode with the Kat.

Basically it involves multisession recording on the same track.

Otherwise I doubt the software could handle two different devices using the same VSTis on the same channel simultaneously.

But I could be wrong. I don't claim to have any expertise with that configuration.

Gary ;)
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
I didn't mean to imply that I want to use them at the exact same time I would use one device probably the Alesis first, then use the KAT . I may do it just the opposite of that as well
 

happyrat1

Destroyer of Eardrums!!!
Joined
May 30, 2012
Messages
13,885
Reaction score
5,581
Location
GTA, Canada
That's doable in a sound on sound overlay mode or whatever Presonus calls it.

You'll just have to configure it properly.

Gary ;)
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
That's the heart of the question is how do I configure my devices within Studio One
 

happyrat1

Destroyer of Eardrums!!!
Joined
May 30, 2012
Messages
13,885
Reaction score
5,581
Location
GTA, Canada
I'd suggest googling or doing a youtube search for tutuorial videos on using the software.

Gary ;)
 

SeaGtGruff

I meant to play that note!
Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2014
Messages
4,120
Reaction score
1,741
The short answer is that the channels shouldn't be an issue at all for what you're talking about.

A longer answer is forthcoming. :)
 

SeaGtGruff

I meant to play that note!
Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2014
Messages
4,120
Reaction score
1,741
Here's a longer reply-- hopefully not too boring or confusing! I'll start with a general discussion before touching on MIDI device setup in Studio One.

As you may know, a MIDI port can either send (Out/Thru) or receive (In) up to 16 channels of MIDI data.

The MIDI device that's sending/receiving the data might not be able to use all 16 channels at once, as that depends on its capabilities. For instance, an analog synth might be able to play only one patch at a time, so it would use only one channel at a time. A MIDI keyboard controller that can be split or layered might be able to use three channels at once for sending Note events. But many devices can indeed use all 16 channels at once.

In fact, some devices might have multiple sets of MIDI In/Out ports, allowing them to send/receive more than 16 channels of data-- 32, 48, 64, etc. (i.e., a multiple of 16). Most DAW software programs can open several MIDI In/Out ports at once, so they can use more than 16 channels, although each port is limited to 16 channels.

The 16 MIDI channels are not "universal." The 16 channels of one port are different-- separate and distinct-- from the 16 channels of another port. Thus, it's possible to be using channel 1 of one port for one thing while simultaneously using channel 1 of another port for something else without needing to worry about them interfering with each other-- although that depends on the situation. (Just because something is "possible" doesn't mean it's always the case.)

So when do you need to worry about this? If you have several MIDI devices connected together in a daisy chain, then each device in the chain is receiving the same 16 channels of information from the device at the head of the chain. In that case you do need to worry about which device is using which channel(s), since you presumably want each device to use different channels than the other devices, otherwise you could end up with all of the devices playing the same thing!

But when you have two or more devices connected to a computer and each one has its own MIDI In/Out ports in a DAW, the channels of one device will be distinct from the channels of the other device(s). Thus, it's okay for you to use the pads on an Alesis VI25 to trigger drum sounds in the Steven Slate software, and at the same time use a KAT Multipad to trigger different drum sounds in the same software.

Furthermore, most DAWs have multiple functionalities-- i.e., they can act as recorders, mixers, sequencers, routers, etc. If you need to, you can set up a track in Studio One to receive channel 1 from the VI25 and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 2, and set up another track to receive channel 1 from the Multipad and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 3, or something like that. In other words, a track's incoming channel number doesn't need to match its outgoing channel number, and it's okay for two different tracks to use the same incoming channel number-- or, for that matter, the same outgoing channel number-- without interfering with each other if those channels are coming from (or going to) different devices.

Different DAWs may have different ways of handling MIDI devices and ports. In some DAWs you can simply connect a MIDI device and start using it, choosing at will which MIDI channel(s) you want to use with that device. But in Studio One you need to "add" a device-- its In/Out ports will be visible as soon as you connect the device to the computer, but you must associate its ports with a device setup. This has advantages and disadvantages. The main disadvantage is that it's a bit of a hassle to have to set up every device before you can use it, especially if you need to set up the same device multiple times in order to accomplish what you're wanting to do. But the advantage is that you have flexibility in how you can set up each device.

Studio One lets you create three different types of device setups-- a "New Keyboard," a "New Instrument," or a "New Control Surface." The "New Keyboard" option is used to set up the MIDI input that Studio One will receive from a device, so it's the type you're interested in.

When you add a new keyboard, you can specify which MIDI channels you want to receive from it. The default setting is for all 16 channels to be enabled, but you can deselect any channels you don't want to receive. You can also filter out certain types of MIDI events from the incoming data. In most cases you'll probably want to accept the default settings-- i.e., receive all channels and all event types.

But there may also be times when you'll want to receive only one channel at a time, or filter out certain types of events. You can create additional keyboard setups for handling those situations.

Note that you can create multiple setups for the same device (i.e., same port), in which case you'll probably want to give each setup a name that makes it easy for you to identify which is which. Studio One will warn you that you've already got a device setup that uses the port, but you can just dismiss the warning.

For instance, I have a Yamaha YPT-400 portable keyboard, which shows up as "Yamaha Portatone-1" in the list of available ports. Excluding the use of styles or "auto accompaniment," I can play up to three different "voices" or instrument sounds on it at the same time-- a Main Voice, Dual Voice, and Split Voice, which the keyboard transmits on channels 1, 2, and 3, respectively. Suppose I want to record the data from each of those three voices to separate tracks. To accomplish this, I could create three separate keyboard setups:

Device Name = YPT-400 Main Voice (or maybe something else, e.g., YPT-400 Channel 1)
MIDI Channels = 1 (i.e., deselect all other channels)
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Dual Voice
MIDI Channels = 2
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Split Voice
MIDI Channels = 3
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

If I add a new track and assign the "YPT-400 Main Voice" device to the track's Input, that track will receive channel 1-- and only channel 1-- from the Yamaha Portatone-1 port. Note that the device will be listed in the track's Input field as "YPT-400 Main Voice | Any" (meaning any channel), but the track will nevertheless receive only channel 1, since that's the only channel which was selected in the device setup.

The "New Instrument" option is used to set up a device for receiving data from Studio One. You won't need to use this option for what you're wanting to do. However, if I wanted to use Studio One to play back a MIDI recording and send the data to my YPT-400 (i.e., to make the YPT-400 play the song like a player piano), I would add at least one "New Instrument" setup for the YPT-400, as follows:

Device Name = YPT-400
Receive From = None
Send To = Yamaha Portatone-1
MIDI Channels = 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16

I know this was a lot to read, but I hope it's been helpful to you. Let me know if you have any further questions. :)
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
Here's a longer reply-- hopefully not too boring or confusing! I'll start with a general discussion before touching on MIDI device setup in Studio One.

As you may know, a MIDI port can either send (Out/Thru) or receive (In) up to 16 channels of MIDI data.

The MIDI device that's sending/receiving the data might not be able to use all 16 channels at once, as that depends on its capabilities. For instance, an analog synth might be able to play only one patch at a time, so it would use only one channel at a time. A MIDI keyboard controller that can be split or layered might be able to use three channels at once for sending Note events. But many devices can indeed use all 16 channels at once.

In fact, some devices might have multiple sets of MIDI In/Out ports, allowing them to send/receive more than 16 channels of data-- 32, 48, 64, etc. (i.e., a multiple of 16). Most DAW software programs can open several MIDI In/Out ports at once, so they can use more than 16 channels, although each port is limited to 16 channels.

The 16 MIDI channels are not "universal." The 16 channels of one port are different-- separate and distinct-- from the 16 channels of another port. Thus, it's possible to be using channel 1 of one port for one thing while simultaneously using channel 1 of another port for something else without needing to worry about them interfering with each other-- although that depends on the situation. (Just because something is "possible" doesn't mean it's always the case.)

So when do you need to worry about this? If you have several MIDI devices connected together in a daisy chain, then each device in the chain is receiving the same 16 channels of information from the device at the head of the chain. In that case you do need to worry about which device is using which channel(s), since you presumably want each device to use different channels than the other devices, otherwise you could end up with all of the devices playing the same thing!

But when you have two or more devices connected to a computer and each one has its own MIDI In/Out ports in a DAW, the channels of one device will be distinct from the channels of the other device(s). Thus, it's okay for you to use the pads on an Alesis VI25 to trigger drum sounds in the Steven Slate software, and at the same time use a KAT Multipad to trigger different drum sounds in the same software.

Furthermore, most DAWs have multiple functionalities-- i.e., they can act as recorders, mixers, sequencers, routers, etc. If you need to, you can set up a track in Studio One to receive channel 1 from the VI25 and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 2, and set up another track to receive channel 1 from the Multipad and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 3, or something like that. In other words, a track's incoming channel number doesn't need to match its outgoing channel number, and it's okay for two different tracks to use the same incoming channel number-- or, for that matter, the same outgoing channel number-- without interfering with each other if those channels are coming from (or going to) different devices.

Different DAWs may have different ways of handling MIDI devices and ports. In some DAWs you can simply connect a MIDI device and start using it, choosing at will which MIDI channel(s) you want to use with that device. But in Studio One you need to "add" a device-- its In/Out ports will be visible as soon as you connect the device to the computer, but you must associate its ports with a device setup. This has advantages and disadvantages. The main disadvantage is that it's a bit of a hassle to have to set up every device before you can use it, especially if you need to set up the same device multiple times in order to accomplish what you're wanting to do. But the advantage is that you have flexibility in how you can set up each device.

Studio One lets you create three different types of device setups-- a "New Keyboard," a "New Instrument," or a "New Control Surface." The "New Keyboard" option is used to set up the MIDI input that Studio One will receive from a device, so it's the type you're interested in.

When you add a new keyboard, you can specify which MIDI channels you want to receive from it. The default setting is for all 16 channels to be enabled, but you can deselect any channels you don't want to receive. You can also filter out certain types of MIDI events from the incoming data. In most cases you'll probably want to accept the default settings-- i.e., receive all channels and all event types.

But there may also be times when you'll want to receive only one channel at a time, or filter out certain types of events. You can create additional keyboard setups for handling those situations.

Note that you can create multiple setups for the same device (i.e., same port), in which case you'll probably want to give each setup a name that makes it easy for you to identify which is which. Studio One will warn you that you've already got a device setup that uses the port, but you can just dismiss the warning.

For instance, I have a Yamaha YPT-400 portable keyboard, which shows up as "Yamaha Portatone-1" in the list of available ports. Excluding the use of styles or "auto accompaniment," I can play up to three different "voices" or instrument sounds on it at the same time-- a Main Voice, Dual Voice, and Split Voice, which the keyboard transmits on channels 1, 2, and 3, respectively. Suppose I want to record the data from each of those three voices to separate tracks. To accomplish this, I could create three separate keyboard setups:

Device Name = YPT-400 Main Voice (or maybe something else, e.g., YPT-400 Channel 1)
MIDI Channels = 1 (i.e., deselect all other channels)
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Dual Voice
MIDI Channels = 2
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Split Voice
MIDI Channels = 3
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

If I add a new track and assign the "YPT-400 Main Voice" device to the track's Input, that track will receive channel 1-- and only channel 1-- from the Yamaha Portatone-1 port. Note that the device will be listed in the track's Input field as "YPT-400 Main Voice | Any" (meaning any channel), but the track will nevertheless receive only channel 1, since that's the only channel which was selected in the device setup.

The "New Instrument" option is used to set up a device for receiving data from Studio One. You won't need to use this option for what you're wanting to do. However, if I wanted to use Studio One to play back a MIDI recording and send the data to my YPT-400 (i.e., to make the YPT-400 play the song like a player piano), I would add at least one "New Instrument" setup for the YPT-400, as follows:

Device Name = YPT-400
Receive From = None
Send To = Yamaha Portatone-1
MIDI Channels = 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16

I know this was a lot to read, but I hope it's been helpful to you. Let me know if you have any further questions. :)

Wow, I haven't got a chance to read it yet but that's awesome, THANK YOU! I should be off in a day or 2 and will be able to spend some time looking over the situations I've mentioned and make use of the suggestions you've made. I REALLY appreciate you help! :)
 
Joined
Mar 25, 2010
Messages
31
Reaction score
0
Here's a longer reply-- hopefully not too boring or confusing! I'll start with a general discussion before touching on MIDI device setup in Studio One.

As you may know, a MIDI port can either send (Out/Thru) or receive (In) up to 16 channels of MIDI data.

The MIDI device that's sending/receiving the data might not be able to use all 16 channels at once, as that depends on its capabilities. For instance, an analog synth might be able to play only one patch at a time, so it would use only one channel at a time. A MIDI keyboard controller that can be split or layered might be able to use three channels at once for sending Note events. But many devices can indeed use all 16 channels at once.

In fact, some devices might have multiple sets of MIDI In/Out ports, allowing them to send/receive more than 16 channels of data-- 32, 48, 64, etc. (i.e., a multiple of 16). Most DAW software programs can open several MIDI In/Out ports at once, so they can use more than 16 channels, although each port is limited to 16 channels.

The 16 MIDI channels are not "universal." The 16 channels of one port are different-- separate and distinct-- from the 16 channels of another port. Thus, it's possible to be using channel 1 of one port for one thing while simultaneously using channel 1 of another port for something else without needing to worry about them interfering with each other-- although that depends on the situation. (Just because something is "possible" doesn't mean it's always the case.)

So when do you need to worry about this? If you have several MIDI devices connected together in a daisy chain, then each device in the chain is receiving the same 16 channels of information from the device at the head of the chain. In that case you do need to worry about which device is using which channel(s), since you presumably want each device to use different channels than the other devices, otherwise you could end up with all of the devices playing the same thing!

But when you have two or more devices connected to a computer and each one has its own MIDI In/Out ports in a DAW, the channels of one device will be distinct from the channels of the other device(s). Thus, it's okay for you to use the pads on an Alesis VI25 to trigger drum sounds in the Steven Slate software, and at the same time use a KAT Multipad to trigger different drum sounds in the same software.

Furthermore, most DAWs have multiple functionalities-- i.e., they can act as recorders, mixers, sequencers, routers, etc. If you need to, you can set up a track in Studio One to receive channel 1 from the VI25 and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 2, and set up another track to receive channel 1 from the Multipad and send that data to the Steven Slate software on channel 3, or something like that. In other words, a track's incoming channel number doesn't need to match its outgoing channel number, and it's okay for two different tracks to use the same incoming channel number-- or, for that matter, the same outgoing channel number-- without interfering with each other if those channels are coming from (or going to) different devices.

Different DAWs may have different ways of handling MIDI devices and ports. In some DAWs you can simply connect a MIDI device and start using it, choosing at will which MIDI channel(s) you want to use with that device. But in Studio One you need to "add" a device-- its In/Out ports will be visible as soon as you connect the device to the computer, but you must associate its ports with a device setup. This has advantages and disadvantages. The main disadvantage is that it's a bit of a hassle to have to set up every device before you can use it, especially if you need to set up the same device multiple times in order to accomplish what you're wanting to do. But the advantage is that you have flexibility in how you can set up each device.

Studio One lets you create three different types of device setups-- a "New Keyboard," a "New Instrument," or a "New Control Surface." The "New Keyboard" option is used to set up the MIDI input that Studio One will receive from a device, so it's the type you're interested in.

When you add a new keyboard, you can specify which MIDI channels you want to receive from it. The default setting is for all 16 channels to be enabled, but you can deselect any channels you don't want to receive. You can also filter out certain types of MIDI events from the incoming data. In most cases you'll probably want to accept the default settings-- i.e., receive all channels and all event types.

But there may also be times when you'll want to receive only one channel at a time, or filter out certain types of events. You can create additional keyboard setups for handling those situations.

Note that you can create multiple setups for the same device (i.e., same port), in which case you'll probably want to give each setup a name that makes it easy for you to identify which is which. Studio One will warn you that you've already got a device setup that uses the port, but you can just dismiss the warning.

For instance, I have a Yamaha YPT-400 portable keyboard, which shows up as "Yamaha Portatone-1" in the list of available ports. Excluding the use of styles or "auto accompaniment," I can play up to three different "voices" or instrument sounds on it at the same time-- a Main Voice, Dual Voice, and Split Voice, which the keyboard transmits on channels 1, 2, and 3, respectively. Suppose I want to record the data from each of those three voices to separate tracks. To accomplish this, I could create three separate keyboard setups:

Device Name = YPT-400 Main Voice (or maybe something else, e.g., YPT-400 Channel 1)
MIDI Channels = 1 (i.e., deselect all other channels)
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Dual Voice
MIDI Channels = 2
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

Device Name = YPT-400 Split Voice
MIDI Channels = 3
Receive From = Yamaha Portatone-1
Send To = None

If I add a new track and assign the "YPT-400 Main Voice" device to the track's Input, that track will receive channel 1-- and only channel 1-- from the Yamaha Portatone-1 port. Note that the device will be listed in the track's Input field as "YPT-400 Main Voice | Any" (meaning any channel), but the track will nevertheless receive only channel 1, since that's the only channel which was selected in the device setup.

The "New Instrument" option is used to set up a device for receiving data from Studio One. You won't need to use this option for what you're wanting to do. However, if I wanted to use Studio One to play back a MIDI recording and send the data to my YPT-400 (i.e., to make the YPT-400 play the song like a player piano), I would add at least one "New Instrument" setup for the YPT-400, as follows:

Device Name = YPT-400
Receive From = None
Send To = Yamaha Portatone-1
MIDI Channels = 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16

I know this was a lot to read, but I hope it's been helpful to you. Let me know if you have any further questions. :)

Wow, that's a lot of useful and appreciated information :) I have both devices running now but I may need to reconfigure my Alesis later because it's able to split the keyboard and I will want to do that at times I'm sure with it being a 25 key bed. I bought it hoping it could. I just set it up basic for now though and the reason my KAT multipad wasn't working is I was trying to set it up as a new instrument but once I set it up as a new keyboard it work... go figure. It's not a keyboard. Oh well it's working! Thanks for your help. I'm sure I'll have more questions later on. I'll post one thing in the curve post I did.
 

SeaGtGruff

I meant to play that note!
Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2014
Messages
4,120
Reaction score
1,741
Yes, I had trouble figuring out how to use my keyboards with Studio One until I finally realized that they had to be set up at least twice-- as "keyboards" and also as "instruments." The terms seem a bit confusing given that "New Keyboard" is used to set up a device for MIDI Input, whereas "New Instrument" is used to set up a device for MIDI Output-- hence it would have been more self-evident if PreSonus just called them "New Input Device" and "New Output Device," or something like that.
 

Ask a Question

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

You'll need to choose a username for the site, which only take a couple of moments. After that, you can post your question and our members will help you out.

Ask a Question

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
14,110
Messages
87,209
Members
13,174
Latest member
sfz5

Latest Threads

Top