Who wants portable triple pedals for Casio?

Discussion in 'Casio Keyboards' started by Greg Barker, Sep 14, 2016.

  1. Greg Barker

    Greg Barker

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    This takes a slightly new direction from the thread I recently started on Portable Triple Pedals for Casios.

    I got some good information to take on installing a new cable on a M-Audio SP-Triple to plug into my PX 160 BK. I asked a friend of mine for sources for a cable or parts to make one. While I was at it, I knew his son had started working in his business fabricating custom devices for the electronics industry in Santa Clara (aka Silicon) Valley, and inquired if his son might be interested in fabricating a number at once. The response was, depends if the number makes it worth while.

    At this point, this is a straw poll to see who might want a portable triple pedal that plugs into those Casios that take Casio's SP-33. Based on the Casio website, this probably includes the following:

    PX-120
    PX-150BK and WE
    PX-160BK and GD
    PX-350BK and WE
    PX-360
    PX-560

    I have no idea what the cost might be at this point. While we would have to pay this young man to perform the adaptation, I will not make anything on the deal other than getting one at the same cost. If there's no interest, I have no problem making and installing the cable myself (if I can replace the screen on an iPhone, this should be easy by comparison).

    Actually, let me amplify that; I don't recommend replacing the screen on an iPhone yourself unless you make a living doing just that. An experienced person can do it in about 20 to 30 minutes. It took me over 4 hours and LOTS of swearing.
     
    Greg Barker, Sep 14, 2016
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  2. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    My advice WOULD be to ask this over on the casiomusicforums.com website or facebook page, HOWEVER, your post would be deleted in a heartbeat. While Casio does NOT officially claim ownership of the forums, they have managed to institute a policy of absolutely no commercial or private advertising or promotion on those sites.

    The sad fact is that those sites exist solely to promote Casio's own products and absolutely no third party adverts or links are allowed.

    My take on it is that you will be fighting an uphill battle to find out exactly how many people would want or need the adapter. Casio has sold literally millions of compatible electronic pianos I'm sure, but again, they may actually hold some sort of patent on the pedal connection and your friend may even end up being sued by Casio just to keep him out of the market.

    Otherwise I can see no other reason why nobody else has marketed an adapter already.

    DIY schematics and plans in the public domain however, fall under the principle of fair use by IP law so long as nobody is making money on them and they are only building them for their own use.

    Gary
     
    happyrat1, Sep 14, 2016
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  3. Greg Barker

    PennyFer

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    C'mon Gary, could you be any more caustic towards Casio? Have you revealed here why you feel this way? If you are going to spread FUD, readers deserve to know about it (your side, at any rate, which I am NOT doubting but it's only one side of the story).

    Regarding this accessory proposal, it's unlikely that the connector is proprietary. I have a lot of experience with such connectors; this one looks a lot like off-the-shelf connectors I have used in my own designs (e.g., from JST or Molex). And as long as no part of the circuit in the SP-33 is copied, Casio can't take anybody to court for selling something that plugs into the connector. Yes, technically they could try anyway but in my opinion it is unlikely. Do you have an specific information that Casio has done that in the past? What Casio would be far more likely to do is claim that if owners use the third-party pedals, it voids Casio's warranty for the keyboard. That's a real risk.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2016
    PennyFer, Sep 21, 2016
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  4. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    All I'm saying is that I'm speaking from experience with the Casio forums.

    Just try and post an ad for a used Casio or even a link to an online vendor who's shipping for a good price.

    It will be deleted instantly and you will receive a moderator's warning.

    Them's the rules Jack.

    If you doubt my word simply go and read the FAQ over there or try to post an ad yourself.

    Don't bust my chops over the fact that Casio is a control freak on a board with which they claim no official ties.

    :p

    Gary ;)

    PS >>> And YES, a connector can be proprietary and patented under IP laws. Google "connector patent" and you get over 8 million hits.

    https://www.google.ca/search?num=100&newwindow=1&safe=off&q=connector patent

    It's not my fault we live in a litigious society. :p

    Even in the PDF I Iinked the author had to Rube Goldberg a connector from standard Molex Headers because there is no off the shelf connector available.
     

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    Last edited: Sep 21, 2016
    happyrat1, Sep 21, 2016
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  5. Greg Barker

    PennyFer

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    I didn't bust your chops about what Casio allows and does not allow on that forum. Notice that I didn't even mention it. I was busting your chops about spreading FUD about what Casio would do to someone who came up with such an accessory. IMO you are just speculating from a place of ill feelings.

    Regarding the connector I feel it is very unlikely that it is a proprietary Casio design, which would make a mate to it unavailable to the OP. THAT is the issue, not that connectors can't be patented. Molex connectors are patented but anyone can buy one, right? I see no proof in the PDF that the author couldn't find an inline mate. It simply looks like he took the most expedient path that worked well enough for him. If I were the OP I would buy a few potential mating connectors after a close look and try them. I see no reason to give up so early in the game.
     
    PennyFer, Sep 21, 2016
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  6. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    Nonetheless the original poster was asking about a commercial startup producing these pedals en masse for public sale.

    Casio has been using that connector for well over a decade and don't you find it odd that no third party has started manufacturing over that time since there have been literally dozens of reports of their pedal being of shoddy construction, falling apart prematurely and unable to work without their own proprietary stand?

    At the very least, a commercial product will have to be keyed to avoid reversing polarity and a locking security tab will be required to prevent accidental disconnects.

    While I'm certain the Casio pedal has these features, I seriously doubt you could buy one off the shelf from a generic supplier at any price. I tried to find one on Mouser's website with zero success. I doubt you'd be able to do any better.

    And before you accuse me of having an axe to grind with Casio, I'm simply stating the facts. Be careful before you begin making personal accusations. I've sent more people from here to their forums seeking help than you've posted messages here in total.

    Gary
     
    happyrat1, Sep 21, 2016
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  7. Greg Barker

    PennyFer

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    After that last paragraph my opinion of you has dropped significantly. In any case, a thinly veiled on-line threat doesn't help make your case.

    The OP has heard your opinion and now he has heard mine. He can make up his own mind about what to do.
     
    PennyFer, Sep 21, 2016
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  8. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    Look, nobody's paying me to respond to help requests on this forum.

    When a 6 time poster starts off by questioning my character what the hell do you expect me to say?

    Let's agree to disagree and go our separate ways in peace shall we?

    Life's WAAAY too short for flame wars.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Sep 21, 2016
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  9. Greg Barker

    PennyFer

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    Posting count is largely irrelevant. And it doesn't give anyone any special status either way. In my case, a low posting count here means nothing at all. You should know of my experience with electronics and keyboards. I'm no newbie with either, I'm simply new HERE. So to even bring up my low post count is, or should be, beneath you.

    I apologize for questioning your motives (I did NOT question your character). You just seemed very caustic about Casio and since I know how they treated you over there I suspected it was the proximate cause. If you say that it has no bearing on your feelings towards Casio, then I admit I was wrong.
     
    PennyFer, Sep 21, 2016
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  10. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    What I know of your experiences with electronics and keyboards at the moment couldn't fill a thimble.

    I neither know you from here nor from casiomusicforums.

    And by the sound of it, anything you know about me from casiomusicforums is likely third hand and distorted and I'd just as soon put it behind me.

    Just because I walked away from that forum of my own accord doesn't mean that I diss their products.

    I've often recommended the PX-5S, the PX-560m and the XW-P1 and G1 to people here seeking a low priced and reliable keyboard.

    You have me at a disadvantage sir. You claim to know me but as far as I'm concerned you just fell off the turnip truck here this morning.

    Vetting a newcomer may not seem relevant to you but I can assure you that the internet is simply teeming with trolls spoiling for a fight and looking to take a shot at the old timers in a forum.

    I may have been guilty of a reactive response at first, but your initial post was clearly confrontational and directed specifically at me.

    We all try to help each other out here.

    This is a friendly community.

    No one is infallible and constructive criticisms and corrections are always welcome.

    And flame attacks, as always, are forbidden.

    Please enjoy your stay.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Sep 21, 2016
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  11. Greg Barker

    PennyFer

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    I identified myself to you through a PM.
     
    PennyFer, Sep 21, 2016
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  12. Greg Barker

    Oriane Lima Hold on

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    I agree ipsis litteris Gary
    Oriane Lima
     
    Oriane Lima, Sep 21, 2016
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  13. Greg Barker

    Becky Administrator

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    Wow, talk about hostile! PennyFer has requested to leave the site, and I am more than happy to grant their request.

    Thanks for not rising to the bait @happyrat1 :)
     
    Becky, Sep 21, 2016
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  14. Greg Barker

    Fred Coulter Collector of ancient keyboards

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    Creating a third party three pedal accessory for Casio keyboards seems to be a bit limited, and a bit expensive. There are three pedal accessories commercially available. Wouldn't it be simpler to merely make an adaptor for an existing pedal to fit the Casio? Then they could make another adaptor for the next keyboard that could use it.
     
    Fred Coulter, Sep 21, 2016
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    happyrat1 likes this.
  15. Greg Barker

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    Becky >>> The funny part is that I really did know him over on Casiomusicforums but when he joined here two months ago he decided to use a totally different alias then sent me a private message once asking why I left their forum and he's posted three messages since then that weren't related to this thread.

    I get about 30 emails a day between forum postings and newsletters I subscribe to.

    How the hell am I supposed to remember him if he's been a professional lurker for the past two months?

    Anyway there's a lot of Casio fanboys over on that site and they refuse to accept any negativity in posts about the product over there.

    Personally I think they make a few good products but most of their bread and butter is still consumer junk for 12 year olds.

    Now I'm sure they're all buzzing away in the casio forums indignantly saying how much better off they are without me :D :D :D

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Sep 21, 2016
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  16. Greg Barker

    Rayblewit Do you think Ray blew it?

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    Well worded . . Cheers to you Gary:)
     
    Rayblewit, Sep 21, 2016
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  17. Greg Barker

    Rayblewit Do you think Ray blew it?

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    Just be aware Becky and Gary . . .This person could easily be lurking and trolling under another name here on this site. They (trolls) Cut and Paste between sites. The less said here the better. Less ammunition!
     
    Rayblewit, Sep 21, 2016
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  18. Greg Barker

    Becky Administrator

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    I have tools against that... :D
     
    Becky, Sep 22, 2016
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  19. Greg Barker

    Alchemy

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    A post or two must have been deleted cause all I saw was making up and all being fine. But btw, I was "partly" kicked out of a non music forum after 12,000 posts, being beyond mod status and being one of the main experts. Their off topic forum was extremely vicious and extremely agenda based and agenda controlled. It was absolutely absurd the topics and comments made under what should be a serious site. But yes, I do knock their product now, but only because now I can, lol. I guess I was slightly in the cult of it before.
    As for here, I don't see anywhere near that insanity, thank God.
     
    Alchemy, Oct 20, 2016
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  20. Greg Barker

    Becky Administrator

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    No posts have been deleted, but PennyFer requested to leave the site.

    It's rare that members cause trouble here to be honest! The only thing I have to really deal with is spam. My rule for forums is 'no personal attacks' - I'm happy for discussions and disagreements to take place because debates are most useful when you get both sides, but if it is taken to a personal level then that's just not acceptable.

    If anyone sees any personal attacks try not to get involved (don't feed the trolls, as they say) - just report it to me and I'll take action :)
     
    Becky, Oct 20, 2016
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