Roland vs Yamaha question

[kevs]

More useful for strings, organs and synths is setting the pedal to sostenudo rather than sustain if that's your only option.

This setting actually creates playable noises instead of each note piling up on top of each other with non decaying voices.

Gary

THANKS Gary, what does this mean? "setting the pedal to sostenudo " .. I ordered this, has not arrived yet..:

Amazon.com: Sustain Pedal for Keyboard, LESHP Damper Sustain Pedal, 6 feet cable with 1/4 inch plug For Yamaha Piano Casio Keyboard Sustain Ped, Yamaha, Roland, Casio, Korg, Behringer, Moog - Universal Foot Pedal: Musical Instruments

Buy Sustain Pedal for Keyboard, LESHP Damper Sustain Pedal, 6 feet cable with 1/4 inch plug For Yamaha Piano Casio Keyboard Sustain Ped, Yamaha, Roland, Casio, Korg, Behringer, Moog - Universal Foot Pedal: Pedals & Footswitches - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

BTW which port does these typically go into on the back?

 

[happyrat1]

It's the button marked Synth at the bottom of the display with all the bank buttons. Piano, Organ, Guitar, Orchestra, etc.

Just hit the one marked synth. It should light up. Then keep spinning the wheel until it hits Syn 99 and Syn 100.

Those are the two theremins.

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

THANKS Gary, what does this mean? "setting the pedal to sostenudo " .. I ordered this, has not arrived yet..:

Amazon.com: Sustain Pedal for Keyboard, LESHP Damper Sustain Pedal, 6 feet cable with 1/4 inch plug For Yamaha Piano Casio Keyboard Sustain Ped, Yamaha, Roland, Casio, Korg, Behringer, Moog - Universal Foot Pedal: Musical Instruments

Buy Sustain Pedal for Keyboard, LESHP Damper Sustain Pedal, 6 feet cable with 1/4 inch plug For Yamaha Piano Casio Keyboard Sustain Ped, Yamaha, Roland, Casio, Korg, Behringer, Moog - Universal Foot Pedal: Pedals & Footswitches - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

BTW which port does these typically go into on the back?

Sustain pedal plugs into the Hold Pedal Jack in the back of the board.

As for pedal assignments.

Hit menu.

Cursor right to System and hit enter

Keep cursoring right until you reach PEDALS

Change your pedal settings in there.

Hit exit twice and it writes to system memory and settings are saved.

Gary

 

[happyrat1]

BTW, Sostenudo is the middle pedal on a real piano. What it does is hold a single note or chord when played while allowing you to play other notes without them all piling up.

Gary

 

[anotherscott]

The Juno is a Synth or Piano or both? It actually just says Just synthesizer on the box (not even word piano). But the Juno you recommend sustain pedal even though it's mostly or 1/2 Synth?

A keyboard sold as a piano can still also have non-piano sounds; a keyboard sold as a synthesizer or workstation or arranger can also have piano sounds. Regardless, if you want to play piano on it, you'll probably want a sustain pedal, so you can use the same pedal techniques you can use on a piano. It's about the sound you select and how you want to play it, not about what they call the instrument. So then...

for plucked instruments using sustain (would be a good benefit/ feature), that would include of course, the Roland, when I am on the piano bank of the Roland DS-88 ie, (not just real acoustic pianos)?

It has nothing to do with what bank you're in. You use the pedal if you want notes to continue to behave as if you're still holding them down after you let go; you don't use the pedal if you do not. Piano just happens to be an actual acoustic instrument that has a pedal for that purpose. But even piano playing doesn't always need a pedal, and conversely, you may be playing a non-piano (including synth) sound where you want it. The thing about plucked instruments is a generalization... sometime it's a benefit, sometimes not. A pizzicato violin is plucked and does not benefit from a sustain pedal. A harpsichord or clavichord or clavinet sound should not employ sustain pedal if you want them to sound authentic, despite being struck or plucked sounds.

Sometimes you can use the pedal just to free up a hand. For example, you would normally never play organ with sustain pedal. But if you want to hold a chord and lift your hand to operate some control or play some other part and you want that organ chord to keep playing, you can use the pedal for that. Just remember, all the sustain pedal does is let the keys behave as if you're still holding them down, even when you're not. It can sound great, it can sound awful, or it can just be a convenience... and there's no 100% rule of "use the pedal on this instrument sound but not that one." The goal is generally not one of following a rule, but rather to use it in a musically pleasing way. But for the most part, you should minimize (or often even completely avoid) using it while playing sounds that don't naturally decay, unless you're sustaining them as explained in my organ example, where you want the notes to ring while you remove your hand to have it do something else (other than continuing to play more notes with the same sound).

For electric guitar, I don't think they use sustain pedals right? or maybe it goes by another name for guitars?

Guitarists do use Sustain, with a Boss (Roland) CS3 Compressor Sustainer and a TC EHGC being two popular ones.

That's a completely different use of the word sustain. That's compression, to stop a single note from fading away, not to allow some notes to ring while you continue to play others. There is no piano-style sustain function that is applicable to guitar playing.

Related to that, I'd be careful about Gary's suggestion of using the pedal on guitar sounds when played from a keyboard. That can easily sound bad and/or inauthentic. It depends on the specific guitar/sound technique you're trying to replicate, and should only be used to the extent that lifting keys on the keyboard is preventing notes from ringing in a circumstance where they would naturally ring on a guitar.

 

[Biggles]

Thanks Biggles, appreciate that as I'm getting also into electric guitar and will at some point put a small pedal board together. I love sustain and I notice how little I get out of my Strat on clean channel of my Fender amp. I thought sustain was mostly from dirty/ distortion, but these 2 pedals will give a clean sustain? How cool. Which of the two is better? I found the CS 3 online but could not find a link to the other one..

Boss is top quality, well built and robust.

Do be advised that buying guitar pedals soon mounts up to hundreds if not thousands of units of currency. Additionally you need a top quality power supply which generally has about six available outputs but do avoid daisy chain power supplies as noise and hum is easily introduced, a mount board and top quality pedal board tape from a specialist guitar shop and definately not off Amazon as the velco on the tape they sell is stronger than the backing adhesive.

I bought a Boss GT100, an ex shop demo unit for half price at a guitar show and it has hundreds of customisable combinations of patches built inso do consider one of these type of multi effects boards, they have built in drum patterns and an excellent Looper. I also play electric Uke and bought a Zoom G1X Four multi effect pedal board so I can be fully battery powered when jamming, this unit has drum patterns, a looper and fifty customisable effects patches available with each patch able to daisy chain five effects, check out the reviews of this amazing little board, my Gibson LP sounds great through it and best of all it is $100 in the USA.

If you want individual pedals then additionally to the CS3 consider an Analogue delay, reverb, a phasor, chorus, and an ibanez tube screamer as a good starter selection, there also so many pedal options available it can be mind boggling.

 

[kevs]

It's the button marked Synth at the bottom of the display with all the bank buttons. Piano, Organ, Guitar, Orchestra, etc.

Just hit the one marked synth. It should light up. Then keep spinning the wheel until it hits Syn 99 and Syn 100.

Those are the two theremins.

Gary

Found it Gary, cool, did not know that as you keep turning the wheel it's keep going on and on 001 001 etc. Wow How many of these sounds do you know? How many can one remember or are favorites?

"Sostenudo" then is the sustain I bought? Been so long since I played a real piano, can't remember -- I remember one is mute I think too.

"Change your pedal settings in there.".. Wow did know there are options of assignment. I assumed you just put in an it sustains..

 

[kevs]

A keyboard sold as a piano can still also have non-piano sounds; a keyboard sold as a synthesizer or workstation or arranger can also have piano sounds. Regardless, if you want to play piano on it, you'll probably want a sustain pedal, so you can use the same pedal techniques you can use on a piano. It's about the sound you select and how you want to play it, not about what they call the instrument. So then...

It has nothing to do with what bank you're in. You use the pedal if you want notes to continue to behave as if you're still holding them down after you let go; you don't use the pedal if you do not. Piano just happens to be an actual acoustic instrument that has a pedal for that purpose. But even piano playing doesn't always need a pedal, and conversely, you may be playing a non-piano (including synth) sound where you want it. The thing about plucked instruments is a generalization... sometime it's a benefit, sometimes not. A pizzicato violin is plucked and does not benefit from a sustain pedal. A harpsichord or clavichord or clavinet sound should not employ sustain pedal if you want them to sound authentic, despite being struck or plucked sounds.

Sometimes you can use the pedal just to free up a hand. For example, you would normally never play organ with sustain pedal. But if you want to hold a chord and lift your hand to operate some control or play some other part and you want that organ chord to keep playing, you can use the pedal for that. Just remember, all the sustain pedal does is let the keys behave as if you're still holding them down, even when you're not. It can sound great, it can sound awful, or it can just be a convenience... and there's no 100% rule of "use the pedal on this instrument sound but not that one." The goal is generally not one of following a rule, but rather to use it in a musically pleasing way. But for the most part, you should minimize (or often even completely avoid) using it while playing sounds that don't naturally decay, unless you're sustaining them as explained in my organ example, where you want the notes to ring while you remove your hand to have it do something else (other than continuing to play more notes with the same sound).



That's a completely different use of the word sustain. That's compression, to stop a single note from fading away, not to allow some notes to ring while you continue to play others. There is no piano-style sustain function that is applicable to guitar playing.

Related to that, I'd be careful about Gary's suggestion of using the pedal on guitar sounds when played from a keyboard. That can easily sound bad and/or inauthentic. It depends on the specific guitar/sound technique you're trying to replicate, and should only be used to the extent that lifting keys on the keyboard is preventing notes from ringing in a circumstance where they would naturally ring on a guitar.

Scott ok got it" after you let go"... thanks.

 

[kevs]

Boss is top quality, well built and robust.

Do be advised that buying guitar pedals soon mounts up to hundreds if not thousands of units of currency. Additionally you need a top quality power supply which generally has about six available outputs but do avoid daisy chain power supplies as noise and hum is easily introduced, a mount board and top quality pedal board tape from a specialist guitar shop and definately not off Amazon as the velco on the tape they sell is stronger than the backing adhesive.

I bought a Boss GT100, an ex shop demo unit for half price at a guitar show and it has hundreds of customisable combinations of patches built inso do consider one of these type of multi effects boards, they have built in drum patterns and an excellent Looper. I also play electric Uke and bought a Zoom G1X Four multi effect pedal board so I can be fully battery powered when jamming, this unit has drum patterns, a looper and fifty customisable effects patches available with each patch able to daisy chain five effects, check out the reviews of this amazing little board, my Gibson LP sounds great through it and best of all it is $100 in the USA.

If you want individual pedals then additionally to the CS3 consider an Analogue delay, reverb, a phasor, chorus, and an ibanez tube screamer as a good starter selection, there also so many pedal options available it can be mind boggling.

THANKS Biggles that unit looks very cool/ sleek, but $500 new not $100. Would you buy one used (mint) or just go new?

How are the sounds compared to the equivanlt Boss pedals? As good or not?

I imagine it has everything you mentioned at the end. How good is it compared to those well known ones.. Ibanez Tube screamer etc, and the myriad of pedals out there.. I know it's bottomless; I have not begun the full pedal reserach yet, but actually I have been taking notes from a some Rig Rundowns. I was thinking because of the cost you mentioend to maybe just get 2-6. That Ibanez was on the list.

But if one unit can do it all.... that would be great....

 

[kevs]

Gary, these just arrived:

Robot Check

I'm completely dumfounded. The sound with them seemed muted low, compared to the speakers using the RCA into the phone jack. went back to the RCA/ phone and compared, and the volume is triple loud, clear and crisp with RCA to phone jack. What creates low, muted volume with dedicated 1/4"..? Baffling.

 

[happyrat1]

Headphone out is low impedance high voltage output.

Line output is high impedance,, low voltage output.

Headphone output is meant to drive 50 ohm speakers directly.

Line output is meant to drive an amplifier's 10 Kohm line inputs.

Don't mismatch impedances or you risk blowing out the driver amps for the jacks.

Stick with the Line Outs and just crank up the volume to a decent level.

I'm surprised you didn't notice distortion from the phone jack ,

Gary

 

[Biggles]

Kevs

Each Boss pedal is generally approx $50 with an RC30 looper at $300 a Compressor sustainer at $100 and a Reverb at $130 a Tube Screamer TS808 $140 (lessor one are not up to it). Each 6 pedals will need a goodquality power supply which is about $35, cheaper ones can introduce hum. Then there is a rack or case plus patch leads.

So you can see cash can soon add up with just a few items and a full pedal board can easily be over $1000.

I can honestly say the GT100 that I bought is as good as the pedals I had and I only had Boos and Ibanez ones the RC30 looper I got off eBay and sold it for 1/3rd more than I bought it for, the Tube Screamer I sold for £25 more than I paid for it so if you buy wisely you can get some good deals out there, a vintage Tube Screamer will sell for hundreds of bucks they are that good.

A used GT100 in top order is worth it especially as the GT1000 is now available.

I hook up the GT100 and use software to update and change the effects patches, specific ones are available to download and install like David Gilmour of Pink Floyd whose unique sound on sound effect I have and it sounds great, even with my poor attempts at playing like the man himself.

If you want to look at the Zoom G1X Four its all of $100 and whilst all plastic it has great sound patches, connected up to the pc and they are easily modified and new ones created so do look at reviews of this great little all in one unit. There are quiet a few of these all in one units

 

[kevs]

Headphone out is low impedance high voltage output.

Line output is high impedance,, low voltage output.

Headphone output is meant to drive 50 ohm speakers directly.

Line output is meant to drive an amplifier's 10 Kohm line inputs.

Don't mismatch impedances or you risk blowing out the driver amps for the jacks.

Stick with the Line Outs and just crank up the volume to a decent level.

I'm surprised you didn't notice distortion from the phone jack ,

Gary

Gary, even with the volume at Max -- the little volume knob -- it pretty low and muddy compared to using the headphone.. But maybe, I would trust you are saying that's not correct reality? Four times as loud and clear and trebly to me that sounds nice -- I have the volume then at 1/4 up only.... Now With LIne out.. at Max it's still soft.. so you know what I'm experiencing. Just a huge difference in volume and tone. BTW I use Bose speakers for my computer for last 5 years, top of the line-- and they go into headphone jack on the back of the 27" imac...So maybe my brain says/ thinks that correct

 

[kevs]

Kevs

Each Boss pedal is generally approx $50 with an RC30 looper at $300 a Compressor sustainer at $100 and a Reverb at $130 a Tube Screamer TS808 $140 (lessor one are not up to it). Each 6 pedals will need a goodquality power supply which is about $35, cheaper ones can introduce hum. Then there is a rack or case plus patch leads.

So you can see cash can soon add up with just a few items and a full pedal board can easily be over $1000.

I can honestly say the GT100 that I bought is as good as the pedals I had and I only had Boos and Ibanez ones the RC30 looper I got off eBay and sold it for 1/3rd more than I bought it for, the Tube Screamer I sold for £25 more than I paid for it so if you buy wisely you can get some good deals out there, a vintage Tube Screamer will sell for hundreds of bucks they are that good.

A used GT100 in top order is worth it especially as the GT1000 is now available.

I hook up the GT100 and use software to update and change the effects patches, specific ones are available to download and install like David Gilmour of Pink Floyd whose unique sound on sound effect I have and it sounds great, even with my poor attempts at playing like the man himself.

If you want to look at the Zoom G1X Four its all of $100 and whilst all plastic it has great sound patches, connected up to the pc and they are easily modified and new ones created so do look at reviews of this great little all in one unit. There are quiet a few of these all in one units

Thanks Biggles, so if I were.. just doing research, to buy the GT- 100m the sounds matches the individual pedals they make? No quality difference? I would think maybe there would be something in individual pedal.. the gT 100 is a simulation of the real pedals, right? And look their famous delay pedals with all the settings and knobs, that could be dialed into the GT 100?. I think the GT 100 seems great.. in sense .. so elegant.. if it came even at 90, 95% as good, convenice unbelivable. Does Boss distortion come close to Ibanez Tube screamer?

 

[Biggles]

Kevs.

All a guitar pedal is a box with footswitch, jack sockets and a circuitboard with the features burnt into a chip and a set of control knobs to vary the parameters.

An all in one board is more or less the same, as Boss make individual pedals and all in one boards I would think that the algorythms used in each device is the same, it does not make business sense to develop and maintain two similar systems for the sheer number of individual pedals that Boss produce.

In an all in one board the individual effects can be daisy chained into a patch with the individual parameters of each effect being adjustable.

Making the adjustments can be viaa computer or on the fly whilst playing just as it can on individual pedals.

A advantage of all in one boards is that if you want a change of tone in a song you simply move up to the adjacent patch where the sounds reside. If you want to do this on an individual pedal system then it becomes more invasive to the performance as you will have to switch in or out one or more pedals and even adjust parameters.

As you can see I am a fan of all in one units.

This is a review by Anderstons who are one of the most respected Music Stores in the UK.

Other all in one boards like Zoom, DigiTech and Line 6 are available so do check these out also.

 

[happyrat1]

Gary, even with the volume at Max -- the little volume knob -- it pretty low and muddy compared to using the headphone.. But maybe, I would trust you are saying that's not correct reality? Four times as loud and clear and trebly to me that sounds nice -- I have the volume then at 1/4 up only.... Now With LIne out.. at Max it's still soft.. so you know what I'm experiencing. Just a huge difference in volume and tone. BTW I use Bose speakers for my computer for last 5 years, top of the line-- and they go into headphone jack on the back of the 27" imac...So maybe my brain says/ thinks that correct

Can you list what exact make and model of powered monitors and/or amplifier you are plugging into?

Gary

 

[kevs]

Kevs.

All a guitar pedal is a box with footswitch, jack sockets and a circuitboard with the features burnt into a chip and a set of control knobs to vary the parameters.

An all in one board is more or less the same, as Boss make individual pedals and all in one boards I would think that the algorythms used in each device is the same, it does not make business sense to develop and maintain two similar systems for the sheer number of individual pedals that Boss produce.

In an all in one board the individual effects can be daisy chained into a patch with the individual parameters of each effect being adjustable.

Making the adjustments can be viaa computer or on the fly whilst playing just as it can on individual pedals.

A advantage of all in one boards is that if you want a change of tone in a song you simply move up to the adjacent patch where the sounds reside. If you want to do this on an individual pedal system then it becomes more invasive to the performance as you will have to switch in or out one or more pedals and even adjust parameters.

As you can see I am a fan of all in one units.

This is a review by Anderstons who are one of the most respected Music Stores in the UK.

Other all in one boards like Zoom, DigiTech and Line 6 are available so do check these out also.

Thanks Biggles, well I think the huge thing is convenience, and getting 100 pedals in one board. The worry, if doing research you find you yearn for other boutique pedals. If you start buying those on top of your all in one board, then it defeats the purpose, so the all in one board, "should" end buying or yearning for all the other stuff.

 

[kevs]

Can you list what exact make and model of powered monitors and/or amplifier you are plugging into?

Gary

Thanks Gary, I got these two little guys. There is nothing else, just two little boxes. What does "powered by" or "amplifier" refer to?

https://www.amazon.com/PreSonus-Eris-E3-5-Professional-Multimedia/dp/B075QVMBT9/ref=sr_1_7?crid=1620LZGYAGUXC&keywords=mackie+cr3+multimedia+monitors&qid=1561502780&s=gateway&sprefix=Mackie+CR3+%2Caps%2C313&sr=8-7

 

[happyrat1]

They're 25 Watts per channel. That should be plenty of power for a normal living space.

The proper way to hook them up is with the Line OUTS on the Keyboard directly to the Line INS on the speaker.

The amplifier is built into the speaker.

You could try adjusting the the two EQ Knobs on the back to give you brighter highs and boomier lows, but that is the correct way to hook them up.

Overdriving the Line INS from the headphone jack is dangerous and could blow out an input or output.

I'd suggest playing the sequencer while you make the adjustments to get the sound you desire.

Also make sure you have the correct polarity on the speaker wire to the passive speaker. Black to black and red to red.

Also check your volume knob on your keyboard.

Gary

 

[kevs]

They're 25 Watts per channel. That should be plenty of power for a normal living space.

The proper way to hook them up is with the Line OUTS on the Keyboard directly to the Line INS on the speaker.

The amplifier is built into the speaker.

You could try adjusting the the two EQ Knobs on the back to give you brighter highs and boomier lows, but that is the correct way to hook them up.

Overdriving the Line INS from the headphone jack is dangerous and could blow out an input or output.

I'd suggest playing the sequencer while you make the adjustments to get the sound you desire.

Also make sure you have the correct polarity on the speaker wire to the passive speaker. Black to black and red to red.

Also check your volume knob on your keyboard.

Gary

Thanks Gary, yes it's good now! Thanks for tips there..... The little knobs, EQ don't seem to do much. What is sequencer? I'm just on page 2 of the manual now!

Well I'm glad I did not have to buy a new something for the speakers...

BTW can/ or do you just leave speakers on all time and power them up with Keyboard, or turn them on/ off each time as well?

There is no black to black red to red to identify them/ so just going by L/R to keyboard L/R

BTW the sustain pedal does not seem work. I have it in the correct pedal hole/ output, press down nothing. You would think that would be intuitive.