Improve sound of Yamaha DGX-650

Discussion in 'General Keyboard Discussion' started by Diane Shelton, Dec 2, 2016.

  1. Diane Shelton

    Diane Shelton

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    I'm sorry I dropped off for a while. Life is too busy! Thank you for these new suggestions. I will hopefully get a chance to try some things tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.
     
    Diane Shelton, Dec 12, 2016
    #21
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  2. Diane Shelton

    delaware dave

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    delaware dave, Dec 12, 2016
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  3. Diane Shelton

    Wes

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    A TRS-to-TS cable is not the right solution, and in fact, can cause problems - if the tip and ring are connected internally, you are effectively summing the left and right channels, which can cause phasing issues (dullness in high end), especially if the sound uses reverb.

    A regular instrument cable, TS to TS, will work fine with this piano. It will give you a mono sound, left channel. I played dozens of shows like this on a DGX-620. If you have a stereo PA, you have the option of splitting your signal with a TRS male cable that ends in TWO TS ends. Then you use two inputs on the PA, and pan them hard left and hard right. I VERY VERY rarely run stereo. It is normally not necessary and sometimes problematic.

    I suspect very very strongly the problem is the PA. OP, rent a powered speaker from your local sound company, and see what that sounds like. Make sure it is a GOOD powered speaker -- QSC, JBL, Yorkville. With a 12" driver. If you live in Canada, I recommend going to Long & McQuade and grabbing an NX55P. If memory serves me correctly, they charge $14/day, $28/week, $30-something a month.

    BTW, depending on your tone selection, your problem might be the FBX. I have seen feedback eliminators get fooled by keyboards before, especially on glockenspiels (e.g. on Born To Run) and Rhodes. I generally only use feedback eliminators on vocal channel inserts for this reason. They are unsuitable technology IMO for the whole mix.

    Wes
     
    Wes, Jan 7, 2017
    #23
  4. Diane Shelton

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    The cables I recommended from Amazon would NOT damage the keyboard or the amp.

    They are TRS to TS Y stereo cables and are exactly what you require to feed a stereo headphone jack to a pair of stereo speakers.

    Please check your facts before posting misinformation.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Jan 7, 2017
    #24
  5. Diane Shelton

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    And plugging in a TS connector into a TRS jack will effectively short the left and right output channels with unpredictable results.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Jan 7, 2017
    #25
  6. Diane Shelton

    Wes

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    Wrong. A TS cable inserted in there will short ring to sleeve, grounding the right channel, leaving the left channel on tip. The outputs on this keyboard are protected through resistors so that shorting the right-channel op-amp is a non-issue.

    Before getting snarky, you should
    a) read what you are replying to, and
    b) post correct information

    Wes
     
    Wes, Jan 7, 2017
    #26
  7. Diane Shelton

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    Nonetheless, the Hosa cables which I linked from Amazon ARE the CORRECT cables for stereo output from a TRS jack.

    And generally speaking, on THIS planet, it's not usually a bright idea to short an output channel to ground.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Jan 7, 2017
    #27
  8. Diane Shelton

    Wes

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    The planetary origin of the equipment is not relevant; what IS relevant is how the equipment was designed. The amplifier is specifically built to tolerate dead shorts on both channels.

    Hooking up pianos like the DGX series with run-of-the-mill instrument cables happens dozens of times every day on stages worldwide. The engineers know this, Yamaha is very good at what they do, and it works perfectly. The only people who DON'T seem to know this are "internet experts" with little real-world experience. Summing both channels into a mono output, however, *will* cause phasing artifacts, and there is only so much Yamaha can do to prevent this from a patch design POV. The issues are most prevalent with patches rich reverb, such as the factory "Digital Grand" one-touch button setting.

    Now I remember why I stopped visiting this forum. The acerbic tone combined with the technical incompetence of the self-anointed deities really is quite off-putting.
     
    Wes, Jan 7, 2017
    #28
  9. Diane Shelton

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    Why is it so difficult for you to grasp that a TRS to Y TS Splitter cable ISOLATES THE TWO CHANNELS AND DIRECTS THEM CORRECTLY?

    You BLATANTLY stated that I was WRONG!

    In the light of this misinformation I merely corrected you.

    Personally I think Yamaha makes a lot of proprietary crap I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole, however, since Yamaha designed their DGX consumer hardware without proper L/R Outs this remains the ideal solution for obtaining a stereo output signal from a DGX.

    Regardless of what your sound engineers are brewing up in a stage setting, this is the only way Yamaha allows its users to output a stereo signal to monitors in a recording studio or other venue requiring stereo output.

    Gary ;)
     
    happyrat1, Jan 7, 2017
    #29
  10. Diane Shelton

    Wes

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    Yes. You were unequivocally wrong about the result of using a TS cable in a TRS jack. It does NOT combine the channels, nor have unpredictable results. It shorts the right channel to ground. This should be easily discernible by examining the construction of the connector in question.

    I'm sorry that being wrong is so traumatic for you. Perhaps this is something you could bring up with your therapist.

    Note that I did not say that a TRS to dual TS cable was a bad idea: I explicitly called it out as a viable solution, and the only way to get a stereo output from this series of keyboards. But the only thing a TRS to TS is really good for is a insert tap to grab a post mic-pre, pre-channel-strip signal from a mixing board. We need to be careful with our nomenclature.

    Note also that most people do not need a stereo solution, many PAs are mono, and summing a stereo signal in the PA can cause phasing problems. AFAICT, Dianne reported issues with both TS to TS and TRS to dual TS cables. It's important that she understand that TS to TS is not the source of her problem.

    I just realized one possible problem source, though. Dianne - set your DGX's volume to noon and see if there is a "20dB" button on your PA's channel strip. If there is, push it.

    But I'm willing to bet that her problem is likely poor response from the PA. Another likely issue for dull sound is incorrect summing of the stereo signal. Dianne, are you using a stereo channel on the PA?

    Wes
     
    Wes, Jan 7, 2017
    #30
  11. Diane Shelton

    happyrat1 Destroyer of Eardrums!!!

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    You know what? Life's too short to argue this bullshit with you. I'm unfollowing the thread and feel free to spread whatever misinformation your twisted logic sees fit to disseminate.

    I gave the OP the right advice in the first place and you can help her blow out her output drivers until the cows come home.

    Seems like you win. Big man. Laugh it up at the tavern tonight about how you managed to troll a thread and talk someone into destroying their hardware.

    Gary Out :eek:
     
    happyrat1, Jan 7, 2017
    #31
  12. Diane Shelton

    Wes

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    No, Gary, you get to win. If I had realized that the email which arrived in my inbox inviting me back for the new year was an invitation to be attacked, I would not have bothered with it. I won't be posting here any longer; it is quite apparent that my input is both unnecessary and unwanted. It is only based upon
    a) discussing this particular issue with a Yamaha service tech
    b) studying the schematic for the output board
    c) playing almost a decade worth of gigs on a very similar model, using that configuration at least 99% of the time.

    However, I must point out, you are taking me to task for something which I did not say. That's alright, I understand that you need to win and a straw-man argument is the easiest way to achieve this goal.
     
    Wes, Jan 9, 2017
    #32
  13. Diane Shelton

    Fred Coulter Collector of ancient keyboards

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    You gigged with a DGX-650? Is your back permanently damaged?
     
    Fred Coulter, Jan 9, 2017
    #33
  14. Diane Shelton

    SeaGtGruff I meant to play that note! Moderator

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    No, Wes said he played a DGX-620. According to its Owner's Manual, it weighs "18.0kg (39 lbs. 11 oz.)" without the stand. On the other hand, the DGX-650 weighs "22.5kg (49 lbs. 10 oz.)" without the stand-- even heavier than the DGX-660, which weighs "21kg (46 lbs. 5 oz.)" without the stand.
     
    SeaGtGruff, Jan 10, 2017
    #34
  15. Diane Shelton

    Fred Coulter Collector of ancient keyboards

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    How'd I get the heaviest one? That's not fair, man.
     
    Fred Coulter, Jan 10, 2017
    #35
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