Yamaha PSR-EW410 or Casio WK-7600 ?


happyrat1

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The first cable is TS mono.

The second one you linked is a TRS Stereo to TS Mono Splitter cable.

The cables you need are these. For Balanced Use Two of These.


For Unbalanced use you use two of these.


DO NOT USE A SPLITTER CABLE FROM THE HEADPHONE OUTS!!! The signal is too hot and you will fry the amp's inputs.

Lastly for home use anything over 60 watts per channel is overkill.

Powered monitors are the best way to go in a home studio situation.

Tell us your budget and we will make some recommendations.

If you want good bass without an additional subwoofer you should opt for a set of monitors with 8 inch woofers.

Otherwise you will get decent results with a set of 5" woofers and you can always add a subwoofer later on.

It largely depends on the type of music you wish to play.

PA amplifiers and Keyboard amplifiers are mainly meant for concert hall applications where you are fighting the noise of the crowd and trying to fill 2000 sq ft of space or more.

Believe me, you don't need more than 30 or 40 watts to start rattling windows and blow out eardrums in a home living room or bedroom.


Gary ;)
 

happyrat1

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BTW, a good set of studio monitors will play with much greater fidelity than any keyboard amp. Like I said, amps are built for road use and venues where the crowd is so drunk they can't tell the difference.

Gary ;)
 
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Right then.
I need a keyboard amp (obviously) mainly for home use, with possibly a bit of extra 'oomph' in case I want to perform in a room that's somewhat larger than a standard living room (say, three times as big, but not with noisy crowds).
I'm not a bass addict, but want good base, nonetheless. Want to hear everything there is to hear, if you know what I mean. Don't want to miss out on certain 'sounds or effects' because the speakers system isn't full stereo.

My budget, well, let's say between €350 and €500 (that's $390 and $560, or £300 and £430).
I'd prefer to avoid having 2 satellite speakers and a subwoofer, and dozens of cables dangling behind my setup. I like to keep things clean and minimalistic ;)

A pair of Roland CM30 cube monitors are just within budget but if I can get cheaper, then by all means. The Roland KC-220 seemed interesting but doesn't get positive reviews, to be honest...

PS I wasn't going to use a splitter cable from the headphones output ;)
 
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happyrat1

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Take your pick in your price range from this page.


Any pair of these would perform well and again, you DON'T NEED AN AMP between the keyboard and the speakers.

If you want additional control over EQ and the ability to add a drum machine or a microphone or an MP3 player to the mix then get a small mixer as well and a shorter additional pair of cables.

Hooking these directly to your keyboard however is totally acceptable.,

If you want to keep the cable clutter to a minimum you can look at bluetooth equipped speakers and a transmitter module. Then all each speaker will require is a power outlet and a single cable each. To my mind to eliminate one more cable from the keyboard it's not worth it.

Trust me, even in a HUGE living room or a small hall these will be enough to damage your eardrums if that's your goal. :p

Gary ;)
 

happyrat1

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BTW, Roland makes great keyboards but their rep is not that great for amps and monitors.

Better names in this department are KRK Rocklt, Yamaha, Mackie, JBL, M-Audio, Behringer.

Most of these will give you much better bang for the buck.

You seriously will not need more than 80 to 100 watts per channel for the hall you described.

Gary ;)
 
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I assume these can be used to connect the FA-08 to a pair of Roland CM-30 Cube monitors (CH2 and CH3 on the CM-30 are both L(mono) + R) ? Plus one more to connect a second CM-30 via the stereo link ?
 
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happyrat1

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I don't know if the CM-30 is balanced or unbalanced inputs so you'd have to ask the people who sell it to you.

However, it's only 30 watts.

Any of the studio monitors I linked earlier would blow it away.

The M-Audio BX8A I linked has 5 times the wattage and has balanced inputs and sells for the same price.


If you have your heart set on the Roland speakers then I have nothing more to add.

Gary ;)
 

SeaGtGruff

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Gary/happyrat1 already told you that the first cable is TS, not TRS, but you can easily tell by looking at the number of painted grooves on the plug, because each one separates the surface of the plug.

One painted groove creates two parts to the surface— the “tip” at the end of the plug and the “sleeve” that’s the rest of the plug, or TS, which can carry an unbalanced mono signal.

Two painted grooves create three parts to the surface— the “tip” at the end, followed by a “ring” between the two painted grooves, and the “sleeve,” or TRS, which can carry either an unbalanced stereo signal or a balanced mono signal. I’m not sure, but I don’t think it’s safe for the instrument to use a TRS plug in a jack that’s designed for a TS plug, because you could short something out.

You might also see plugs with three painted grooves— TRRS, or tip-ring-ring-sleeve. These are typically used for a stereo connection for headphones plus an additional mono connection for a microphone, such as for headsets that gamers or telephone support personnel wear.
 
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On the shop's website, I used a filter to search for TRS cables. And this one
was one of them.

So, either the shop's website has got it all wrong, or this site
hasn't got a clue, either.

As far as I can tell, the cable in the link above definitely has a tip-ring-sleeve jack. What am I missing ? I understand that a TSR cable can carry a balanced mono signal, or an unbalanced stereo signal. In the case of the FA-08, the outputs are two balanced mono jacks which then go to the Roland CM-30 CH2 or CH3 L(mono) + R inputs. Same with the Laney FH150 (in which case we would use the CH3 or CH4).

Furthermore, apparently, as I've read, when you use an amp with a single stereo input, like the Roland KC-80, you can use a TSR cable from just one of the balanced outputs on the FA-08 and it will be recognised as such, since it's supposed to be wired like that, and that short circuiting used to be an issue but is now a thing of the past...

But you seem to tell me that I should use a cable with TS plugs ? So, could two TS cables carry a balanced output from the FA-08 to the CM-30 ? I'm getting confused a bit. Don't remember it being so complicated back in the days :p
 
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SeaGtGruff

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But the REF600 (not REF610) which you had linked to previously is the one that Gary and I were saying is TS.

As I said, Gary already told you that the REF600 is TS or mono-only. And there were a number of posts between your earlier post that included the REF600 and my later comment. So that gap probably confused the issue, and it didn’t help that I didn’t quote the post with the link I was referring to.

I was simply explaining how you can look at a plug and tell by sight whether it’s a TS, TRS, or TRRS plug. :)
 

happyrat1

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TS and TRS cables both come in two sizes. 3.5 mm and 6.3 mm

What you require are 6.3 mm cables. TRS if you are connecting a balanced output to a balanced input, otherwise a simple TS cable will suffice.

We've already established the FA-08 has balanced outputs.

What we don't know is what amp you are plugging into and whether or not it is balanced.

Even so, there's no harm in plugging a TS cable into a TRS balanced output since all that will result is a slight diminishment of volume.

NO SPARKS WILL FLY.

Plugging a TRS cable into a balanced output and an unbalanced input MAY cause problems though.

UNLESS YOU ARE SURE THE AMP IS BALANCED stick with TS cabling.

Gary ;)
 

SeaGtGruff

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Even so, there's no harm in plugging a TS cable into a TRS balanced output since all that will result is a slight diminishment of volume.

NO SPARKS WILL FLY.

Plugging a TRS cable into a balanced output and an unbalanced input MAY cause problems though.
Yes, that (second half) is what I thought— that plugging a TRS plug into a TS jack is a no-no.

I wasn’t certain about the other way around— plugging a TS plug into a TRS jack.
 
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Well, it doesn't say whether either the Roland CM-30 or the Laney AH150 are balanced or not. Can't find it on Google either. Will have to mail those companies to find out...
 
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The Laney uses unbalanced. Starting to understand now. Ordered the Laney AH150 with a pair of mono TS jack leads, to connect to the L+R inputs on the amp.
Sorry for the confusing posts, I told you I was a bit rusty ;)
Will keep you posted as I go along...
 
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Since this has been discussed way beyond my depth of understanding, I'll not pontificate.

I too am shopping for a new keyboard.

I will say, as a 20-year CASIO user, the newer models have been substantially cheapened. They have also taken away the BEST features in the later machines.

My CASIO 7500 has now worn out its third volumne knob. The last one only lasted three gigs. Various things keep breaking. My WK 3800 is still cranking, and has NEVER broken.

The dummy wheel for selecting the sound is one of those steps backwards. They replaced the keypad with the wheel with the 7000 series. So, now you have to select a category, then wheel until you reach the number. The wheel is very sensitive and easily glides past the one you want. On stage this is disastrous. Previously, there was a keypad. You knew the number you wanted, so hit "tone" and key in a two or three digit number. Boom, new sound.

Another new feature in the newer models was moving the phones jack to the BACK of the machine. Terrible design flaw. The earlier models had the phone jack to the bottom left side, facing the player. Now just plug it in and keep going . . . rather than leaning over, trying to find the plug, and fumbling to plug it in . . . and then the cable is stringing across the keyboard!

Yamaha keyboards, while much more expensive, seem to be designed by people who play keyboards. The features and the implementation of the features is more elegant, and direct. They seem to take care in supporting the live gig musician.

If you play at home, by yourself, and can take your time, and care in using the keyboard -- CASIO will be a great choice. They both have basically the SAME functionality.

If the keyboard goes on the road occasionally, and must perform under the rigors of live giging ... hauling in, hauling out, etc, etc, then I'd shop for a keyboard built a little tougher for performance. The extra cost will pay off in quality.

I love the CASIO speakers, and the fact it runs on batteries. The Yamaha PSR-EW410 76-key Portable Keyboard is the closest you can get to the CASIO. It too has speakers. https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PSREW410--yamaha-psr-ew410-76-key-portable-keyboard

Just sayin'
:)
 

SeaGtGruff

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Unfortunately, I think Yamaha and other keyboard manufacturers have also “cheapened” their models as far as the quality of the materials used— on their lower-end models, anyway. This can be something of a blessing in some respects, at least as far as the weight and portability of a keyboard. But it can be a curse as far as parts that break more easily or are prone to developing other problems.

Yamaha and other keyboard manufacturers seem to love those big “data dials” that you spin around to select a voice, style, song, or parameter setting. I can see how they can be useful for scrolling through a long list of voices and such, but I’ve never been a fan of them. I always use the numeric keypad if I know the number of the voice, style, or song that I want to select— or, if I don’t know the number, I start with the Category up/down buttons and then switch to the plus/minus buttons to advance through each voice, style, or song in the given category.
 
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Since this has been discussed way beyond my depth of understanding, I'll not pontificate.

I too am shopping for a new keyboard.

I will say, as a 20-year CASIO user, the newer models have been substantially cheapened. They have also taken away the BEST features in the later machines.

My CASIO 7500 has now worn out its third volumne knob. The last one only lasted three gigs. Various things keep breaking. My WK 3800 is still cranking, and has NEVER broken.

The dummy wheel for selecting the sound is one of those steps backwards. They replaced the keypad with the wheel with the 7000 series. So, now you have to select a category, then wheel until you reach the number. The wheel is very sensitive and easily glides past the one you want. On stage this is disastrous. Previously, there was a keypad. You knew the number you wanted, so hit "tone" and key in a two or three digit number. Boom, new sound.

Another new feature in the newer models was moving the phones jack to the BACK of the machine. Terrible design flaw. The earlier models had the phone jack to the bottom left side, facing the player. Now just plug it in and keep going . . . rather than leaning over, trying to find the plug, and fumbling to plug it in . . . and then the cable is stringing across the keyboard!

Yamaha keyboards, while much more expensive, seem to be designed by people who play keyboards. The features and the implementation of the features is more elegant, and direct. They seem to take care in supporting the live gig musician.

If you play at home, by yourself, and can take your time, and care in using the keyboard -- CASIO will be a great choice. They both have basically the SAME functionality.

If the keyboard goes on the road occasionally, and must perform under the rigors of live giging ... hauling in, hauling out, etc, etc, then I'd shop for a keyboard built a little tougher for performance. The extra cost will pay off in quality.

I love the CASIO speakers, and the fact it runs on batteries. The Yamaha PSR-EW410 76-key Portable Keyboard is the closest you can get to the CASIO. It too has speakers. https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/PSREW410--yamaha-psr-ew410-76-key-portable-keyboard

Just sayin'
:)
I think that you missed the OPs post where he bought a Roland FA08
 

SeaGtGruff

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Possibly, but these sorts of threads are read by other people who are thinking about one or another model, so it never hurts to add more comments pro or con.

I hope we hear some more from the OP about that FA08!
 
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Possibly, but these sorts of threads are read by other people who are thinking about one or another model, so it never hurts to add more comments pro or con.

I hope we hear some more from the OP about that FA08!
I can see how they can be useful for scrolling through a long list of voices and such, but I’ve never been a fan of them. I always use the numeric keypad if I know the number of the voice, style, or song that I want to select— or, if I don’t know the number, I start with the Category up/down buttons and then switch to the plus/minus buttons to advance through each voice, style, or song in the given category.
Exactly! After all, how many voices do you use on the typical gig? a dozen maybe? I kept a "cheat" list with the main voices ... tap "Enter", "512" and play the steel drum solo, tap the Piano to return to the song. So easy, and fool proof -- instead of spinning that stupid wheel while squinting trying to see the names rush by! Only someone who doesn't play music would design a system like that. They're engineers, not musicians.
 
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> he bought a Roland FA08

Looking forward to his reports . . . although in the beginning I thought he was comparing similar keyboards. It's a far cry from $400 to go to $1,400 !!! :). <grin> NO speakers ... I'll be shopping for one with practice speakers.
 

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